L.A. Marzulli's Blog

Politics, Prophecy & the Supernatural

Round up the Gays? What about Grace and Mercy?

Posted by lamarzulli on June 1, 2012

How to use this site:  At the top of the page you will see a list of upcoming speaking events that are highlighted in red.  Directly underneath this is the daily Blog Post.  Scrolling down is the complete list of all Speaking Engagements, with dates and links. The last section is, In Other News, this is where I post seven stories that I believe are pertinent to prophecy and the birth pains that we are currently in.

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June 8-10: Cornerstone Fellowship Maryland!  L. A. returns! 

Cornerstone Fellowship Center : Conferences

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Commentary & Analysis

by

L. A. Marzulli

I will have a special announcement tomorrow, so make sure you check back on Saturday….. Acceleration Radio will be live on the airways soon!!!

NC Church Supports Pastor Who Made Anti-Gay Remarks

NC Church Supports Pastor Who Made Anti-Gay Remarks

“Build a great big large fence 50 or 100 miles long. Put all the lesbians in there. Fly over and drop some food. Do the same thing with the queers and the homosexuals. Have that fence electrified so they can’t get out. You know what, in a few years, they’ll die out. You know why? They can’t reproduce,” Worley said, according to a YouTube video of his sermon.

Recently a pastor in North Carolina made national news when he sated that gays and lesbians should be rounded up, put in a fenced in area and left to die out.  Sounds like the new Auschwitz to me.   Not a lot of grace and mercy there.   I want to walk through this as the media jumped all over this story and because of it some will lump all Christian together.   The Bible is a love story about redemption.  The crux of it has to do with the propensity of all people, due to our fallen state, to do “stuff” that is wrong and the man who came to rescue us from that “stuff.”

OK, so some of you are shaking your heads and saying there are no absolutes that what is wrong for one person is right for another.  How about the recent murder and cannibalism in Miami?  What about kidnapping an innocent boy and then killing him?   How about the murder of children in Syria?  What about the rape of women in Afghanistan?  These examples are, in my opinion absolutes.  This “stiff” is all sin and it is repugnant and devastating to all who commit it and will eventually lead to death.  However, we have someone who came to remove our sin and lift us from the bondage of it, creating a new life for us.  Jesus did this by shedding His blood on the cross at Calvary 2000 years ago, and by believing in Him and asking for forgiveness we have eternal life and we are freed from the sin that puts us in bondage.  That’s the deal and the back-story.

Now lets look at the specifics.  Which “sin” is more repugnant, adultery or incest?  Look at what those actions do as they leave entire families devastated. I believe that incest is far more prevalent than homosexuality and in fact can lead a person to a gay lifestyle as their sexuality was violated by a family member.   What about a child who is raped by someone?  How does that affect their sexuality?

What about pornography, where the porn stars and the viewer are both in bondage.  I have heard porn called the barbed-wire of the mind and watching it is highly addictive.  How many pastors are in bondage to it?  How many men are held captive by it?

Gays and Lesbians and everyone else need to know about the love of Jesus and the life changing grace that He can extend to their lives.  Who amongst us came to Him without sin?  Who amongst us is not guilty of breaking what was written down and declared on Mount Sinai, the law of God?  Who has not broken these commandments?

In  closing today’s post:  All of us had a moment where grace and mercy was extended to us.  Why do we single out the gay and lesbian?  If grace and mercy does not apply to them then what?  Let me put it straight here, no pun intended,  that while I do not condone Gay marriage, the gay life style, or teaching that homosexuality is an alternative life style, these folks need the same grace and mercy that all of us were given.  The position of this pastor is nothing more than a modern day witch-hunt.

What he should have done is said something like, for the next three months I want this congregation to fast and pray for the gay and lesbians in our community.  I want us to target our prayers and ask Father God for miracles.   Isn’t that what we are supposed to do?  Our weapons are not carnal, therefore prayer is our greatest weapon.  Sadly those who sat in the congregation gave the pastor an ovation.

Pray and we will see lives change.  Pray and the lost will become found.  Pray and He who died for us will extend his grace and mercy.

I was a fornicating, drug taking, occult practicing, Guru worshiping, hippie, and He got me.  He changed my life and I am forever grateful.  I’m glad I wasn’t rounded up with all the other Hippies and put in a compound.   Amazing Grace how sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me….   

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The L. A. Marzulli Lecture Series is Available Now!

Go to www.lamarzulli.net

Save $10.00 by buying the whole series! Only $50.00 + s&h

Conferences are wonderful but many people can’t attend for a variety of reasons.  Sam Miller teamed up with me and produced The Lecture Series.  There are over nine hours of information, complete with Power Point presentations that are taken directly from my books.   These are a great resource and will arm you and your loved ones with the facts that you need to understand the times in which we are living.  L. A.

Hi, I just wanted to say thank you for your watchers series as well as the messengers of deception! I watched you on Sid Roth and had wanted to watch your video’s for some time now, so i ordered them.  They really answered a lot of questions I had about the many deceptions going on and how satan uses all these different people to push his agenda.  The way you teach about the new age and other deceptions makes it very easy to spot now, which is awesome!!!! I do have a question though.  Have you looked much into the deception befalling the church via the Kundalini spirit??  I have recently been studying on this topic and have been very alarmed and greatly saddened by what I am finding.  I even see this manifestation in my family. Anyway, thank you for your work. The Lord has given you a very needed ministry to keep the eyes of His children open and watching in this crazy time we live in!
Thanks again!  God Bless
 Karen W.

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Chitzen Itza Trip! 

Sign up now as I will be speaking on December 21, 2012 at the Mayan Temple!  We are raising money to get Russ Dizdar and Richard Grund on the Trip.  So far we have $2250.00 our goal is $12,000.  Donate now by going to the right side of this page and clicking DONATION.   I won’t go alone on this trip!  L.A.

Yucatan 2012

L. A. Marzulli will be speaking:  “Exploring the meaning and relevance of two myths and their relevance in this time of transition in 2012; the stories of the “watcher gods” in the first century text, “The Gospel of Enoch”, and the prophecy of the return of Quetzalcoatl, the feathered serpent-god of the Aztecs. We will be examining correlations between these two in light of our contemporary times.”

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L.A. Marzulli Speaking Engagements!

June 8-10: Cornerstone Fellowship Maryland!  L. A. returns! 

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June 22-24:  Chicago Conference with Russ Dizdar: http://www.chicagosummit.net/
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July 6- 15:  Montreal Canada – 37 Annual International Conference

http://www.iiihs.org/SSF-IIIHS_Conference_2012_early_bird_registration_form.pdf

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July: 13 -15: BRANSON Prophecy Conference – www.prophecyinthenews.com
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August 30:  September 1: Genesis Project
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September 29: Newark Ohio with Russ Dizdar! (Details pending!)
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October 13: Portland Oregon – Big Foot Conference!
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October 20-21:  Just ADDED!  Conference with Dr. Stan Montieth -DETAILS COMING SOON!
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 November Conference with Randy Demain
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December 21: Chitzen Itcha, Mexico – Conference -
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Links to all speaking engagements will be up soon! 
To book L. A. drop him an email la@lamarzulli.net
Disclaimer: L. A. Marzulli speaks at a variety of venues that feature other speakers.
L. A. Marzulli in no way endorses or necessarily holds similar views, as those who share the platform with him, unless specifically noted!

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In Other News: Tracking the Birth Pains

French police hunt Canadian body parts suspect

French police hunt Canadian body parts suspect – Friday, June 1, 2012 | 2:13 a.m. – Las Vegas Sun

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Chagas: Is tropical disease really the new AIDS?

Chagas: Is tropical disease really the new AIDS? | The Lookout – Yahoo! News

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Maryland man admits eating victim’s heart, brain 

Cops: Maryland man admits eating victim’s heart, brain – Times Union

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New Mexico wildfire, largest ever in the state, continues to burn 

New Mexico wildfire, largest ever in the state, continues to burn – CSMonitor.com

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Bigfoot sighted locally? Watch the video 

Bigfoot sighted locally? Watch the video – Bigfoot sighted locally? Watch the video: Local

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18 Examples Of The Nanny State Gone Wild 

18 Examples Of The Nanny State Gone Wild

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IDF Retaliates After Deadly Kidnapping Attempt, Mortar Fire 

IDF Retaliates After Deadly Gaza Escalation – Defense/Security – News – Israel National News

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174 Responses to “Round up the Gays? What about Grace and Mercy?”

  1. Greg the Electrician said

    Yes, we are to tell them the Gospels, regarding the Coming Kingdom of God, as well as about the life of Christ and His Work. If they don’t want to listen, we are to simply walk away.

  2. Elaine said

    L.A.!!!!! This is one of your absolute BEST teachings! Thank you.I think the quasi Christians like this pharisee are the reason we all get hated.

  3. Eric W. said

    Why are gays and lesbians being singled out? Because the secular world is shoving it down our throats and our kids throats 24/7. Pick your outlet. You can’t get away from it if you try. Gay this. Gay that. ALL the time.

    THEY have singled themselves out.

    Your third grader can go public school now and get “educated” about homosexuality with an officially government sanctioned textbook and program.

    That’s why. There’s going to be blowback. The blowback unfortunately goes way past constructive levels like the NC pastor being indicated here.

    Hate the sin, not the sinner. There has to be a balance between discernment and accountability along with grace and mercy. You have a lot of people out there that go to the other extreme where it’s all “grace, mercy, love” and you can do whatever you want because you’re forgiven and it just doesn’t matter. God is the big Santa Claus in the sky and it’s all good. That doesn’t fly, either. I’m appalled at some of the distortion of the Bible I’ve seen attempted by some to try and excuse and justify homosexuality as well. That’s blasphemy.

    Unfortunately that pastor you talked about is the kind of Pharisee type that does a LOT of damage in terms of public testimony and of course the secular world and media are going to jump all over that and milk it to the moon. I don’t think that’s an accident. Another move on the chessboard so to speak.

    Sin is sin but I do think some sins are considered more grievous than others.

    Example from the New Testament, KJV, 1 Corinthians 6:9-10: “9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

    10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.”

    The blasphemy I’ve seen…and it’s lame…is: “Oh well, JESUS didn’t talk about any of this! JESUS didn’t talk about homosexuality!”

    Obviously those people don’t really believe Jesus is Who He Says He is nor do they really believe the ENTIRE Bible is God’s inerrant word.

    You go into the Old Testament and I think it’s pretty clear how God feels about homosexuality and a bunch of these other sins.

    Obviously ANY of these folks can and do receive grace and mercy when they accept the Lord into their lives. But like any other sin, that doesn’t mean they can just go ahead and keep on living that lifestyle.

    Glad you’re getting your radio show situation straightened out. :)

    • Eric W. said

      P.S. Overall, I do agree with your blog today LA. Just wanted to make a few points there. :) It’s ALL bad sin. REALLY bad but NONE of it is “the unpardonable sin.” Thank God! :)

    • Phoebe Wagner-Wootten said

      L.A., thank you for giving your insights on this topic; an excellent and timely Blog as always!

      Eric W., I agree with you completely! I’m beginning to think Hollywood/media are the Devil’s outlet, as they are largely responsible for inundating us with both the ET phenomenon AND homosexuality. They’ve been slowly, over the years, making what was once taboo seem cool. There are many kids today in the Jr. High to Sr. High school age bracket who have experimented with “same-sex” just because they were curious after seeing it on television and movies, and many now think it is “cool” to be bi-sexual. These are kids who never had these “desires” before, as in they were previously only attracted to the opposite sex.

      You are so right that this subject is everywhere. Since the Pres. came out publicly in favor of same-sex marriage, all you see on Facebook now are posts either by people saying they are “LGBT and proud of it and everyone needs to just deal with it” or “straight” people saying they support LGBT and same-sex marriage. And those who comment saying they are Christian and the Bible says it is wrong are verbally attacked in a nasty, hateful way! I’m appalled at the number of people, most in the 30 and under age range, who say they do not believe in God; that Christians are all suffering from a mass delusion and the Bible is nothing more than a fairy tale written by men who wanted to control people’s lives. And this is all within one generation!! When I was growing up (I’m 48), the vast majority believed in God and the Bible, thought ET’s were hogwash and homosexuality was wrong and immoral.

      You can certainly tell that the demons have been working overtime in order to change the way people think in just ONE generation! It’s so great to find sites like this where one can openly talk about God and be among others who still share the Christian values and ideals! I really look forward to each day’s Blogs and news items and everyone’s wonderful comments! Keep ‘em coming!!

      Thanks and God Bless!

      Phoebe

    • RJA said

      Agree with Eric completely. The reason ‘gays’ are singled out, LA, is because the homosexual agenda is trying to force their views on the rest of society, and thereby, they become the arbiters of morality, rather than God. If anyone disagrees, they are accused of hate crimes (which now gets into the area of policing thoughts).

      You don’t see open and unrepentant murderers demanding to be made clergy in the church, nor do you see adulterers demanding to make congregations ‘adulterer-friendly.’ Yet the homosexual agenda flaunts their sin proudly.

      Today’s announcement that a golden-age (ie, 1940s era) superhero, the original Green Lantern, will now be gay, is completely emblematic of what I’m talking about. The homosexual agenda seeks to redefine morality so as to make their perversion not only acceptable but preferred.

      So, is homosexuality worse than all other sins? Of course not; the Lord extends grace to all who will turn to Him. But homosexuality is unique in that its proponents are attempting to redefine godly morality and in doing so directly oppose the Word of God. In that, they make themselves anti-Christ.

    • Eric W. said

      Here’s what’s going to happen next after we get same sex marriage legalized in the country which I fully expect to happen after the “re-selection” in the Fall if not sooner: The polygamy folks ought to have an easy slam dunk. I’m waiting for them with the clout of the Mormon Church any day now. Why not?

      I’ve also been seeing the NAMBLA folks put out feelers and carefully using some of the same rhetoric and talkings points the militant homosexual group has been using these several years. It’s all going to happen and sooner than people think. Why not? After that should come the bestiality folks. “It’s ok if it’s love and consentual” etc. etc.

      When you have a society that has no values and is basing itself off of evolution and everything’s random and meaningless…there IS no line drawn in the sand.

      http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-205_162-57444533/sex-offenders-fight-for-right-to-use-facebook-dozens-of-other-sites/

      I’m really worried about sexual offenders civil rights and especially whether or not they can get on the Internet to continue to cultivate their evil. I’ve lost sleep over it.

      Yes, I’m being sarcastic. ;) That shows you right off the bat how skewed our society is. We’re REALLY even debating or worrying about letting these people have access to the Internet.

      If it were up to me they’d NEVER be on the streets EVER again. Period.

    • RJA said

      Just to be clear, I in no way condone what that pastor said. The only way to change hearts and bring people out of sin is the gospel. Gays need to hear and experience the love of God just the same as any other sinner.

    • Bernadette said

      Right on Eric, I loved your reply, but you don’t have to go all the way to the OT, Romans 1 talks about how homosexuality is given to a nation that has deserted GOD. A nation that stops worshiping the living GOD and exchanges Him for the creatures to worship.
      I agree 100% with LA that these ppl should not be rounded up and put on their own island, also that their are far WORSE sins than homosexuality. But I think that pastor and his church were just letting off steam. Maybe it wasn’t the best place to do it, but he probably didn’t know he had a little RAT FINK in the church just waiting to get some attention by turning the pastor over to the wolves.
      These so called “gay” which really means happy, people are homosexuals and not gay. They have opened themselves up for targets, they shove what they do in their bedrooms down our throats, our childrens, and our grandchildrens. Since most of the pupulation is heterosexual like it’s supposed to be. Homosexuals shouldn’t expect us to get up and give them a standing ovation for being different.
      I personally feel real sorry for homosexuals, they most certainly need grace, if they will listen. But unfortunately their is a large group of Christians now who say that being homosexual is not a sin. I commented on a video at youtube the other day and was barraged by a bunch of ppl who called themselves Christian who said that JESUS was ashamed of me for saying homosexuality was a sin. So all you can do is pray and hope that some will open their eyes.

    • NICK said

      we must remember the problem is The Accuser and his demons which are all on overtime, but i can say this bunch here on the good team are to and i cannot say that about most Christiandom. the assult from evil is coming into complete readiness, education, religion, politics, and the media are vile. and those are small weapons of the enemy that only The WORD Of GOD can defeat.

  4. Caleb Cox said

    Amen, amen, a thousand times AMEN! Spot on L.A., what an absolutely miraculous difference it would make if Christians today were praying for those in Sin around them instead of calling down judgement upon them, which we are admonished NOT to do in scripture. Your post certainly inspires me to pray harder in intercession for the gay and lesbian community and for their healing and salvation.

    • Elaine said

      I agree…..last week I saw a lesbian lady who I happen to know became that way after a horrible abusive marriage to a man…..not to excuse it but we need to be understanding. I do not seek out her company but do consider her a friend. Love the sinner, hate the sin.
      She was at the farmer’s market and walking with a man. She came up and hugged me and I said “Good job….you are out with a fella!” and she poked my arm and said, “He’s just a friend” so I responded….”Well, it is a start, God love ya!”
      The whole meeting had a friendly ambiance but I was able to nudge toward what is right better than if I had said, “Get away from me until you give up your sin””

    • Daniel Ellis said

      God sais to worship Him in spirit and in truth…I don’t know about his truth but he certainly doesn’t have the right spirit.

  5. Lisa said

    It’s strange to me that a “man of God” could say such things about the people that Jesus came to save. I’m from NC myself and, unfortunately, I tend to get lumped in with “Christians” like is because they make the news. I voted for the gay marriage ban and I stand strong in the fact that homosexuality is wrong, but why does this pastor and others like him think that it’s OK to want the gay community dead. According to Scripture, those in sin are dead already… But Jesus raises people from the dead. I was in a church service where a visiting preacher made very similar remarks several years ago. It made me physically sick to hear the language he was using to describe them. It definitely wasn’t an overflow of love.

    I was reading Scripture the other day and found the places where true people of God are called peculiar. Wanna know a synonym for peculiar (in the English language)… queer! Hummm…. maybe “Christians” should stop calling homosexuals that name. Just a thought :)

    • NICK said

      That word “peculiar” could be translated consecrated to God, in fact i think the root of Nazarite means to consencrate or dedicate.

    • Lisa said

      Yes I know. That’s why I said in English. Someone that would want to use that against us is not exactly looking for the Biblical meaning, but what they know already. I was just making a point that we should be careful what slang we throw around to try and insult other :) God Bless.

    • As Christians we must be aware that when society says sinful behavior is fine and an individual that can be a figure head uses hateful rhetoric like this pastor, it is a deliberate setup by Satan to create havoc and conflict between the two groups. He will do this between the sexes and races too. Our response to all sin should be to reroute them to a relationship with Jesus. The resulting guidance of the Holy Spirit will convict their heart of the sin and they will

    • change their ways.

    • NICK said

      i agree, our true faith is being turn in on us like we are the evil abominations. good call

    • JLL said

      Another North Carolinian here.

      The Presbyterian church in town — in opposition to its denomination — has publicly taken the same stand as LA wrote so eloquently this morning. I don’t know what will come of it, but they continue to bring up the issue … definitely doing God’s work.

      Kudos, LA! And thanks for the reminder to pray more about it. I regularly pray for a Christian friend in another state who (last I knew, anyway) was addicted to pornography, and for some former co-workers and a friend’s relative here who are gay. But I don’t pray much for the issue as a whole.

      My precinct voted 80% for the marriage amendment (one man, one woman); only one precinct in the county voted the other way (and not the precinct I would have expected). Unfortunately the majority in my neighborhood are confirmed non-voters and don’t see any reason to change.

  6. Daniel Ellis said

    Right on L.A.! God bless you brother!

  7. NICK said

    yo L.A., how are ya? about the bigfoot, i am only speculating but it or they may be real but they are unrelated to adham(mankind) or eth-ha-adham(the one man Adam). at Ashfalls,Nebraska creatures were frozen in position the moment they died from what i think Jer.4.18-23 describes. it may be a ancient creature because all the main Indian tribes have knowledge of them that they do not seem comfortable talking about. i believe the Native Americans may have answers about mysteries like how the Bat Creek Stone was inscribed with paleo-hebrew, could the Levites have made it to this continent apprx.100BC-50AD?

    • Robert said

      Don’t tell me that all those wacky Mormon stories are true?

      How did they get the word Mormon from Moroni?

    • NICK said

      that is funny, it is no big deal. the day Glenn beck had a hour on Fox he used to talk about unearthed hebrew inscribed artifacts i almost feel out of my seat when i heard it. since i learned Mormon doctrine includes that and stuff about the Indians. i never new that, for about 10 years i have followed a biblical archeologist i came across, Dr. Barry Fell, i think the Mormons are missing 75% of the truth there and about 50% wrong. after reading L.A.’s post i think i will comment on it as a very profound timely subject that take priority over bigfoot. i hesitate but if you want sources of info completely different than Mormon dogma about some stuff i will post it or email it. the ashfalls nebraska part is unrelated and it will make you think if you take a easy drive to Nebraska. God bless and have a good night.

  8. Phyllis said

    LA, thank you for your post today. I wonder if that pastor has forgotten that he came to Christ a sinner…. The Bible says we are to love as He loves and I’m reminded of the verse…. “But God demonstrates His own love for us in this: that while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us!” I thank God that he didn’t give us what WE deserved. In fact had He given that pastor what he deserved, he wouldn’t be around to make such a stupid statement.

  9. Gluttony is also a sin… and so is gossip… what if every person who practiced these things were rounded up and put into a camp. There wouldn’t be a church in America that wouldn’t be represented – and most would be present entirely.

    • Linda said

      lol!!!! Don’t you touch my buffet! I’ll spread gossip about you, :) wink!
      Soon they won’t need Jenny Craig or Weight Watchers as famine is coming!
      Just read Noah Hutchings news letter re. Modern Cannibalism-Infant Cannibalism, abortions and Pepsi& Co. useing aborted fetal tissue for favor enhancement along with aprx. 100 other companies and the subsiduaries!

      70Ad according to Josepus Bk6, chap3 Wars of the Jews Famine was so great they ate their friends(roasted) and their children!!! Where are we now and where are we heading! When the blood flows off the abortion tables and mopped up and down the drains does it not come back in the water we drink! Does it cry out as Ables did to GOD? (? by TrueNews Host) It’s also used in medicine, foods and other enhancements. When do we eat and start to change our DNA? We need to leave this earth sooner and not later!!! Milk from hormones fed to cows, chicken, beef scary! He/TrueNews.com said either 5/18, or 24th show He and his wife drink only almond milk now, think of Alasks salmon, Pacific Tuna= a big mandatory diet is coming!!! Then their sin will be muttering and complaining like the Jews in the desert with Moses!! I say they appear to following another Gospel/another Jesus as Johanna M.(Hal Lindsay’s wife) stated so well! Surely we are going to see what the so called churches are really about and what they believe. Another Gospel with another Jesus! :( We need foreign Missionaries to come to the US churches and teach them about the REAL JESUS!! sarcasm added

  10. nomemoleste said

    Why hesitate to call apostates false christians?
    They look and sound like they’re saved, but their actions expose them. Hate is the same as murder. All sin is deadly. Even the sin of being “just regular folks” that reject Christ. These same fake-christians put homosexuals in the Nazi concentration camps.

    I really enjoyed LA’s rant today. There was no theater … all heartfelt. Not something said a hundred times. I’m glad he spoke out for what’s right. I’m convinced that silence when something should be said is false-wtiness just as much as hate-speech is a false-witness. Yes, we’re to speak the truth in love. And it’s not loving to let people fall headlong into the snares of the rebel angels without at least saying something, while praying within.

    I went 5 years earlier in my life where I claimed to be bi-sexual. It was mostly sexual experimentation, but I strongly believe that it was also part of that downward spiral of sin that involves opening gates (and strongholds) through drugs, drunkeness, the occult, and …ahem… politics. The same time I was checking out Lilly and Leary, I shifted to libertarian politics. It’s just another form of rebellion.

    Jesus brought me out of all of it by His own words in the gospels. I used to draw on the Bible for political rhetoric. The gospel of the Kingdom of Heaven is part of the gospel of grace. From libertarian, I eventually became a christian anarchist (after the writings of Eller, Campbell, Ellul…). But even that was transition into pure devotion to Christ and His Kingdom, within and soon coming. All my patriotism shifted, along with my identity. The nation of my natural birth is not my nation, no more than the physical body I have now can be the body I’ll have in eternity with Christ.

    The point is I don’t identify with my old life. I’m a new creature. Reborn in Christ. Nor do I identify with apostates. It’s the same thing. They may call themselves Christian, but they aren’t saved if they think Christ tolerates homosexuality or tolerates hate.

    My 2 cents…

    • Elaine said

      Well said….the only thing I could add is : Two wrongs cannot make a right!

    • Yes, but three rights do make a left :-)

    • Lol, I messed that joke up. It’s been a long week

    • NICK said

      most profound, important comentary i have seen is your comment,”apostates are not false-Christians, that word “false” could save more from taking the mark of the beast than any word i can think of, in greek as refering to the false-christ it is what most think anti-christ translates to but it is really: instead, for, in place of, often used to denote substitution, example “the spirious messiah, another christ. the rider of the first white horse in Rev.6, that can be confirmed from the greek for the word “bow” in that verse; toxon= imitation compare Rev.19. GOD Bless and have a restful evening.

    • Great testimony Nomoleste. I feel bad that I skimmed it before, but when I went back it really shook me. Your openesss and sincerity is commendable and something we should all seek before the Lord. God bless you.

    • Eric W. said

      Awesome testimony!

    • Brian said

      “They may call themselves Christian, but they aren’t saved if they think Christ tolerates homosexuality.” Quite a stretch and certainly not anyone’s job to declare someone unsaved because they misunderstand what the bible says about homosexuality. Dangerous ground………..don’t know why so many brothers and sisters do this. Not our job or place or right to stand on the sidelines of someones life and mandate eternal life. Come on peeps. Having said that, how two big hairy truck drivers could fall in “love” with each other is beyond me.

  11. Adding my Amen to what L.A. said today. I knew homosexuals from kindergarten on. Two of them became world famous artists. And died of AIDS. Whose fault?
    I give that question over to God as I cannot judge. I don’t know how they got that way. I just know their sin was not worse than the average sins we practice (I won’t say “we church people practice” as I am now out of my last church). But I agree with L.A. also on this very good point he made: there ARE sins which are obviously “worse”, the ones L.A. enumerated which are pure sadism, pure demonic possession, pure evil. Most homosexuals are sinful but not pure evil.

    But I do agree also with those who say the homosexuals have an agenda to change society to their way, and that is not good. It would NOT bring greater love and harmony to the community.

    There is no way to end any comment on this subject, as only God has the answer here.

    • Robert said

      I would also question how far they plan o take that agend. Will they be kind enough to tolerate dissent if they gain power? Or will the truth become illegal?

  12. Linda said

    I was a fornicating, drug taking, occult practicing, Guru worshiping, hippie, and He got me. He changed my life and I am forever grateful. I’m glad I wasn’t rounded up with all the other Hippies and put in a compound. Amazing Grace how sweet the sound, that saved a wretch like me….

    Mee too! I am glad to call you my brother and excited to meet you one day in Heaven(unless you get near Tampa,Fl in person lol).. I also am glad that he guided me back to HIM and then showed me who HE reall IS and not a Catholic god! Kept me on the track as I drifted often and got me to the hands of Jesus and Jesus placed me in HIS BODY! and sat me in Heavenly places. That is one of the BEST hymns we all hear and cry!

  13. Eric W. said

    Financial: Awesome economy there. Great jobs report news. As always, they never include the people that have quit looking for work outright otherwise our numbers would be the same as Europe’s: Around 20 percent unemployment give or take.

    Strange weather patterns: I live in Western Ohio. An hour and change north of Columbus and an hour east of Ft. Wayne Indiana. Last week we had a heat wave with 95 degrees and on May 28th we broke a new heat record for that day for ALL recorded history.

    Wanna guess what my high is today? 55 degrees. In June! Thank God…I mean that thank you LORD that it hasn’t gotten violent!

  14. Frank said

    In other news, the relaunched DC character alan scott (original green lantern) has now been made gay. Originally he was hetero, married with a kid. But it’s a different universe so…

    Also, I have several gay friends, and in some ways, they treat me better than some of my straight and Christian friends do. They know I am a Christian, and I’ve shared some with them, but they aren’t really into that. But the door is open should they want to and they know where I stand. Hopefully they have seen Christ’s love in me.

  15. I heard on the Hagman & Hagman Report that Greek parents are leaving their children at the Greek Orthodox churches because they cannot afford to feed them. Now there are reports that authorities cannot feed prisoners.

    Greek Prisons are Running out of Food

    Posted by: Soren Dreier

    At a time when the entire country is being tested by the economic crisis, some people are quite literally on the verge of destitution and hunger. At a time when the empty state coffers can not support any concept of a welfare state, with “frozen” financing towards education and health, the prison system could not be an exception.

    The financing for many prisons has decreased to a minimum for some months now, resulting in hundreds of detainees being malnourished and surviving on the charity of local communities.

    The latest example is the prison in Corinth where after the supply stoppage from the nearby military camp, the prisoners are at the mercy of God because, as reported by prison staff, not even one grain of rice has been left in their warehouses. When a few days earlier the commander of the camp announced to the prison management the transportation stoppage, citing lack of food supplies even for the soldiers, he shut down the last source of supply for 84 prisoners. The response of some Corinth citizens was immediate as they took it upon themselves to support the prisoners, since all protests to the Justice ministry were fruitless.

    In the past few days groups of Corinth residents have started collecting food as a small token of solidarity and respect to people who may be denied certain rights by justice but not their human dignity.

    The Corinth prison is in need of rice, pasta, frozen meat and eggs.

    The prisons in Patra and Alikarnassos have also been experiencing food supply problems lately, as the prisoners who cannot afford to buy food from the prison canteen are left without food.

    Source: ZenHaven DK

    “http://beforeitsnews.com/story/2208/084/Greek_Prisons_are_Running_out_of_Food.html”

  16. Julie said

    I live you LA – great blog:)

  17. Julie said

    I love you LA – great blog today:)

  18. Debbie C said

    Well said LA. I live in NC but had not heard about that pastor’s remarks. Reminds me of what Creflo Dollar said about mowing down people with an automatic weapon who didn’t pay their tithes.

    • Robert said

      No self respecting minister would live with the name Dollar.

    • Frank said

      I did a Blog once about one of his devotionals. Basically, it was a “how to capture and care for your own angel” thing. Link to follow.

      He OCCASIONALLY has good teaching, but often it’s kind of odd and prosperity focused, in my observation.

    • Frank said

      For anyone bored enough, here’s one of Rev. Dollar’s seeming forays into the New Age. I may be wrong though.

      http://dontaskthatinchurch.blogspot.com/2011/05/i-receive-email-devotional-every-day.html

    • NICK said

      i do not agree at all about Creflo Dollar! i have deep doctrine disagreements with him in some areas but as far as a pastor i think he can preach/teach about the “milk” very well. he is able to go deep into some truths that are his area of knowledge which is not prophecy but if i was recomending a pastor to watch to learn Salvation topics, how to grow into a wise Christian, and pauline epistle stuff. he goes for 3-5 months on 5 days a week teaching a topic like “faith” ect. and drive the topic home for his flock. i think his name gives him a uphill battle. anyway, God bless and good night.

    • Daniel Ellis said

      False teachers always lay Truth next to error…..would you eat a three egg omlet if one of the eggs was rotten?

    • That video makes me want to cry

  19. issacsgma said

    Pakistani brothers arrested over ‘cannibalism’
    The police had arrested earlier this week two brothers, Arif Ali, 40, and Farman Ali, 37, for allegedly digging up newly buried corpses and eating their flesh

    http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/2011-04-07/pakistan/29391807_1_corpses-brothers-human-flesh

  20. Bernadette said

    I’m sorry LA but who even let this leak to the press? What a pastor says in his own church should stay there, not be told to the news reporters. I’ll tell you if I were sitting in that church I’d of given him a standing ovation too. I for one am SICK and TIRED of having gay issues shoved done my throat, and my grandchildrens throats at school. Try: 1. Harvey Milk day for example. A new day were teachers have to teach kids about the “Normalness and the great people who have been homosexuals” 2. Even after we’ve voted for same sex marriage to be illegal, it has become legal. 3. Our supposed president saying that during his next election he’s going to have it rain men! I’d like to know what that means. As Christians we’re just sick and tired of them shoving their nastiness down our throats.

    I don’t think anyone in that church really would like to see any one rounded up and put in a fence, I think it was just a release of built up tension concerning all this evil, and the fact that Christians are being bashed from every side. My husband donated some money to buy the soldiers over seas some Bibles, as soon as they got there they were burnt as trash because the officials didn’t want anyone to be made to feel uncomfortable. EXCUSE ME! What about the Christian men who wanted the Bibles in the first place? No body cared about them. Hillary Clinton was on the news defended the action, and calling the Koran holy, while the Bible is just trash.

    We’re fed up….It was a joke to relieve some tension as I can see it…And I have this to say to who ever left church that day and ran and told the news people….

    Proverbs 6:16-19 These six things the LORD hates, yes seven are an abomination to HIM:
    1.) A proud look
    2.) A lying tongue
    3.) Hands that shed innocent blood
    4.) A heart that devises wicked plans
    5.) Feet that are swift to running to do evil
    6.) A false wittness who speaks lies
    And finally the abomination 7.) One who sows discord among the brethern.

    I think the person who ran out and told the reporters hit # 4, # 5, & # 7
    We’ll just have to see.

    • Bernadette, I think your anger is misdirected. Your anger should be at Satan. Yes, we all are sick and tired of being force fed this in society. The purpose Satan does this is to elevate righteous anger. It is a provocation. And as soon as a pastor steps out of line like this NC pastor, he will be held up as the poster child of Christian bigotry. Now the same media that force fed us that sin as being acceptible will be the bull horn that castigates those who speak out against that sin. You are falling into Satan’s trap.

      The point is that ALL sinners should be given Jesus, regardless of the nature of that sin. I once was an alcoholic, adulterer. Now I am baptized in the spirit. My past sins are no more, no less reprehensible than homosexualality.

      I do hear your frustration. It is real. The only thing I can suggest is to give it to the Lord. All sinners will stand before a Holy Judge and have to answer for their sins.

    • NICK said

      living in the time or hour we live in you should expect nothing less, Matt24.37. what we have to do is get that Gospel Armour on!

  21. windsofchange said

    Great thoughts and truth LA!!!
    I thank you for addressing this issue…it is the Love of God that brings man (kind) to repentance….

  22. nomemoleste said

    Matthew 5:43-48

    43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

    44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

    45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

    46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

    47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

    48 Be ye therefore perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.

  23. NICK said

    now that i have gone back and read your post today L.A. i believe it illustrates why being a Christian is the longed for faith because from the depths of God’s Love He will forgive what is named by Him an abomination. also it confirms that today’s political and social even secular world is that world-age or kosmos system is the season of Matt.24, Luke21, 2Pet.chp.3, and Romans 1. these things have always transpired but “it will be as in the days of Noe” and the sin of Sodom is coming up unto God again. come Lord Jesus

  24. richard said

    This pastor is clearly out of line and there is nothing Christ like about what he said.
    We need to be in prayer for him.

    However I think many christians sometimes view homosexuality as the unforgiveable sin and its clearly not. We will be sitting side by side with Gay christians in heaven who said the Lords prayer and claim Jesus as the messiah.

    Sin is sin. Sadly though Colorado has many alternative churches which believe that there are many paths to heaven that endorse homosexuality which we all know there isn’t.

    Side Note

    I do believe though that in an effort to avoid hate laws by christian leaders who are failing to stand up for the bible.

    I was upset that no christian leaders called what Dan Savage did at a christian high school wrong. No christian leader to my knowledge stood up and said Dan Savage You are wrong are Your comments are wrong in the media. I applaud what Mr Savage is doing by speaking up to bullying topic.

    But listen to what Dan Savage says about the bible. He starts by saying “We can learn to ignore the it Bull*** in the bible about what it says about gay people. He says, “The bible is a radically pro slavery document” We just need to ignore all the BULL**** in the bible”

    He failed to mention his position on Sodom and Gomorrah.

    The christian community in opionion has become soft. Romans 1:16 I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God for the salvation of everyone who believes: first for the Jew, then for the Gentile.

    Sin is wrong all sin is wrong and we must not endorse wrong sin. However in these last days we must also stand up for the written word of christ.

  25. Debra said

    Every single one of us here was born into sin; don’t forget that lest you walk the way of the Pharisees. So in a strange, odd kinda way we can say yes, homosexuals were born that way. In the OT book of Deuteronomy human sins were categorized and certain sins had stricter consequences than others. But in the NT it is by the loving and merciful grace of Almighty Yahweh through His son Yeshua’s sacrifice that ALL people are given the chance to receive Him and follow in His way. Jesus’ own words proclaimed His way as narrow…. scary, seemingly “hateful” and intolerant stuff in the ways of the world. That is the way of it. Yet… He…forces…no one. Satan is more desperate than ever for he knows his very existence is drawing to a close. So what “better” way to magnify human division (particularly in the western world) than to keep us focused on things called ‘victimization’. Managed agenda indeed.

    • NICK said

      although, Deuteronomy is the core of by the Law is knowledge of sin. after that covenant, with a generation that turned around at Kadesh-Barnea after having seen awesome Plagues on Eygpt and The Red Sea, and wanted to go back to Eygpt. after that last book of Moses we are accountable for each version of each sin by laws and ordinances. i do not believe at birth as much as media, MTV, the internet, politics which in 1969? started to remove any view but a secular on in public school, now i think the powers that be have the ability to promote any sin that is popular for principalities of evil to promote and condition the youth and entire population of a Nation and to fullfill Matt24.37 and 2Tim.3.1-4

  26. gerie said

    I was so disappointed to read Christians joining with the world, condemning Pastor Worley. Has anybody bothered to get the rest of the sermon? Or has everyone judged and condemned the man on only a portion of his sermon? If you go to part two, the part they convienently leave out, he says this to the homosexuals from behind the pulpit:* “You can be born again. You can go to God’s Heaven. There is no sin that the blood of Jesus can’t wash away.”* There is much more that he says using the Bible.

    What did he say that was so wrong, anyway? Homosexuals are trying to indoctrinate our little ones to learn and practice their sick, perverse behavior. Have I offended anybody calling their behavior sick? Their behavior is perverted and according to God, its an abomination! The Pastor is right and should be applauded. Most Pastors these days don’t have the nerve to preach against homosexuality and then when we finally get one who will, his own brothers and sisters side with the world, against him! He never said to kill them like they’re reporting. Did you hear what he actually said? He said to put them somewhere apart from others. Why? Because they are pushing their agenda and trying to change laws and steal the hearts and minds of our little ones. God’s little ones. What would Jesus say about these hungry wolves who are attempting to steal His children away from God? Tell me, whose idea sounds more radical? Pastor Worleys or the Lord Jesus Christ?

    (Mathew 18:6)
    6 But whoso shall offend (offend here means to influence or cause to sin) one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea.
    7 Woe unto the world because of offences! for it must needs be that offences come; but woe to that man by whom the offence cometh!

    The modern day church is seeking the worlds approval. God forbid, that we would ever want them to think that we are not loving. Jesus sounds more like Pastor Worley in Mathew 18, then some of these fearful, timid Pastors, who hide behind pulpits preaching sweet sermons that do no good and don’t warn of judgement to come. Loving our enemies shouldn’t stop us from declaring the sinfulness of sin. Thats what the light does! It exposes darkness. And we need to be just as blunt and forth coming about it as Jesus was and stop trying to be so politically correct. We might win the approval of eachother with our “love doctrine”, but one day we will stand before the judge, and He will decide which of us was more like His Son? Who expressed His will before sinners, most accurately?

    According to God’s word, (Romans 1:32) homosexuals have the witness in themselves and already know that what they are doing is wrong. They don’t need to be coddled in their sin, but exposed with hope that the word of God, will lead them to repentance. And that is love’s ultimate goal. Their guilty consciences take great pleasure, when because of sympathy for them, they are able to persuade us to change our mind, and side with them against God. We need to take a firm stand against this sin and we need to be very careful when we decide to side with the world against our Pastors, and condemn those, who are actually doing their job.

    • Well, if I must evaluate the pastors comment for its merits, then I would start off saying that what he suggests not even feasible. Homosexuality is not passed down through genes from parent to child, so to suggest that they would.die out is totally ignorant. Homosexuality is one manifestation of sin of not being baptized in the spirit. It is not a condition that will “evolve” out of people once they die.

      More to the point, rounding up people based on a sin is totally unbiblical. Jesus tells the sinner to come and be cleansed. There is no rounding up of sinners. There is no distinction between this sin over that sin. There is however someone in history that did condone rounding up certain groups of people (including homosexuals) and isolated them to die. Hitler and his concentration camps.

      Yes we are angry at our children being exposed to this lifestyle, but I am even more angry at their being exposed to Satan’s antics across the board. Once you draw a distinction of one group of people being evil over another group of people, it is easy to justify doing all sorts of evil to the first group. Do it for the children. Do it for our future prosperity and protection. I am sure Hitler used similar language against his belief the Jews (and homosexuals, the blind, the deaf, the mentally incapacitated, those with birth defects, etc.) were unclean and therefore must be isolated. What you condone is a slippery slope to hell. Give justice to God for he is the ultimate loving, righteous and merciful judge. Justice in the hands of humans is corruptible and can not be trusted.

    • gerie said

      Jesus also said many things that were misunderstood and taken out of context by those who didn’t understand. To believe that the man meant to literally round them up is to misunderstand his intentions. If you will take the time to watch part two you would see his heart and would realise that he’s our brother in Christ, who is doing his best to condemn a sin that God hates. Homosexuals are trying their best to change the way society in general sees this particular sin. Shouldn’t we push back with the truth? They have already intimidated the church into being politically correct and saying things such as, this sin isn’t worse than any others.But this sin is particularly bad because once accepted and especially once its written into our laws, it influences the overall morals of society and spreads like a deadly cancer and will bring the judgement of God upon a nation . If it wasn’t that bad, God would never have made an example of Sodom and Gomorrah for those who would afterwards dare to indulge in the same sin. We should always defend our Pastors and explain to others that he was misunderstood and that he loves the homosexual, but must condemn their sin.

    • You bolster your fears with false doctrine.

      I never suggested that one sin isn’t worse than any other. I say they are equally reprehensible, including the sin that we believe we are like gods fit to judge what is sinful in the eyes of the Lord. Any and all sin will make us unqualified to approach the Lord in His righteousness. That should scare the begeebers out of us, but it doesn’t because we are so busy saying we are better than those. What good will that belief do for us, when Jesus spits us out of His mouth?

      You should read the story of Dietrich Bonhoeffer. You say we should ALWAYS defend our pastors. No we shouldn’t! Pastors are not incorruptible. Whole churches in Germany followed suit in WWII.

    • gerie said

      We used to be sinners also, but once we are saved we have a mandate from God to agree with His word and condemn sin where ever we find it. Especially in those who are suppressing the truth in unrighteousness, and we should never allow anyone to keep us from our task by pressuring us with political correctness. We don’t sympathize with their sin. Jesus never did that. He always told them “Go and sin no more.” When we came to Christ, we didn’t sympathize with our own sinful tendencies, or we wouldn’t be saved. We were hard and direct with ourselves concerning our sin and we agreed with God and with the truth, that our sin was worthy of death. And so is theirs. Today’s popular church message is the “love gospel” and kindness and understanding of sin. Jesus never gave us authority to grant them Gods mercy. Only God can do that. He does that just by letting them live another day, while living in complete rebellion to Him. To have patience with them and allow them to live a little while longer, IS His mercy. But that mercy won’t go on forever if they choose to cling to their sin. That’s why we should encourage them to repent, before their time runs out. We are supposed to preach the Gospel, nothing more and nothing less. Homosexuality is condemned in Romans and its our job to tell them that. After being born again, we have traded sides. We are no longer in the kingdom of darkness. Now we condemn those things we used to love. We have to be just as hard and straight forward with them as we are with ourselves. If we are constantly making excuses for our own sins, we will also teach others the same behavior. Jesus said if our hand causes us to sin, then cut it off. That’s how clearly Jesus always warned others about the deadliness of sin.

      And we should always defend our Pastors who are preaching against sin, according to Gods word. It always amazes me how that the church is quick to side with the world against those who don’t seem “loving” enough, but when Pastors preach that homosexuality is OK, there is only silence. Deadly silence.

    • Elaine said

      Yes but in most of our day to day meetings sexuality is not the subject that comes up. So, if a gay person tells me they are gay I say that I don’t think that is right and if they want to talk about it they will hear some scripture that they may not want to hear but I do not condemn the person or shun them when the topic is “Hello, isn’t it a beautiful day?”

      They know I do not approve of that facet of their life……but when someone just says “Hi” I am not going to jump right into, ” You must repent of your homosexuality or I will not talk to you”…….

    • gerie said

      I agree with you, that we should live the truth and many times they are convicted just by being around us. However this is a Pastors job. If its not his job to do these things, then whose is it? And when he is teaching his congregation that homosexuality is sick and perverse, there is nothing wrong with that. God is not condemning this Pastor for how he chose to creatively illustrate his point. He never meant that he would literally do those things. Can’t we give him the benefit of the doubt? Especially after watching the rest of the video where he reaches out to them in love? Were we there? Did we see and hear every single word he said? What bothers me the most is how we are so quick to agree with the world against our own, who are doing the best they can, to do the job God has called them to. None of us are perfect, why do we point an accusing finger as if we were?

      Jesus said that all would know we were His disciples because of the love we all have towards eachother. He didn’t say they would know who we were because of the love we have towards the world. What I see is that we are always siding with the world against ourselves. Thats why the church is so weak and they are strengthened daily in their sins. We help the enemy do his job. We keep pointing our fingers at our brothers and sisters in Christ. The Bible says we should do good to all men, but ‘especially’ those in the household of faith. Pastor Worley needs our prayers right now. He is being harassed by outsiders and condemned by insiders, those who should be loving and protecting him. When one of us is suffering we all suffer. We’re all part of His body. Even Pastor Worley.

    • Brian said

      Worley knows as a Pastor that he is to be above reproach/ blameless (1 tim 3:2), so why are u so perplexed with the blowblack? Yes pray for him, pray that his tounge will bring life and not death, mercy and not judgement. Gerie, you said, “We used to be sinners also, but once we are saved we have a mandate from God to agree with His word and condemn sin where ever we find it”. What scripture verse supports condemning it wherever we see it? And, are we still sinners after we are saved?

    • gerie said

      Brian,
      I left you a reply, but somehow it was posted at the bottom of the page.
      God Bless

  27. nomemoleste said

    Sexual sin in all forms leads to death. Spiritual death already exists. The outward manifestation is a result of what already exists in the heart. Could be death of a relationship, or death of a family, or social death, or physical death.

    It gets worse. Most violent crimes occur among family members. Abortion, divorce, sexing up children(*), all come out of sexual sin. Incest and pedophilia recognize no boundaries. Sexual depravity brings blindness and jadeness about crossing into gross perversion. Such as glorified in popular shows, concerts, and video games full of gore, domination, and all manner of bizarre creatures.

    (* dolling kids up like beauty queens, romanticizing teen love videos, eroticising cartoons like anime, hyping sex characteristics in comic superheroes)

    Where there are no boundaries, the wickedness of the rebel angels can manifest and indeed are invited. When people make themselves a nest for foul spirits by tearing down limits, then bestiality, necrophilia, torture, and sex magic become acceptable. Sexually transmitted plague can then spread including to those living with the infected. The progression — like with the rebel angels before the flood — can spread to all flesh. Chimera and hybrids could form new species — predator species that consider humans just meat.

    Eating human flesh is taboo. Bestiality is taboo. It’s not that we can’t act like beasts or become beasts. Look around. The beast nations are rising. It’s part of the judgment on the world, and not just America. The tares have been sown broadly.

    The enemy remains the rebels angels. They kept not to their own estate of old. They crossed bounds. And in the fall mankind also crossed bounds. The end is to become like them. It’s not complicated. It’s disobedience.

    There are plenty of passages in Revelation 21 and 22 that I believe quite plainly tell there will be no gay christians in Heaven. Nor rebel christians. Nor adulterous christians. I think they follow “their own notions of Christ” and not Christ Himself. And He will say to the abortionist christians and rebel christians — “depart from me, I do not know you.” And they don’t know Him. They join instead to the rebel angels and become like them. And they will suffer the same fate. As in the days of Noah… we see it happening around us. The nephilim also sprang from human lines.

    Matthew 13
    47 Again, the kingdom of heaven is like unto a net, that was cast into the sea, and gathered of every kind:
    48 Which, when it was full, they drew to shore, and sat down, and gathered the good into vessels, but cast the bad away.
    49 So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just,
    50 And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth.

    • John Michael said

      Genesis six tells us that all flesh had become corrupted. What God had created and was pleased with He became sorry He had made and He flooded the earth and killed all but eight and the animals that He choose and called to the ark.

      Yeshua tells us that His return will be precipitated by a time that will be just like it was in the days of Noah. Not sorta like, not kinda like, but just like. What is coming to the earth is the same sort of corruption that was present in Genesis chapter six. Most fail to really grasp the enormity of how bad it was before the flood and it did not take long for the fallen angels to re establish themselves in the minds and hearts of man.

      We as disciples have been dropped behind enemy lines and though we’ve been set free we continue to live here in a fallen world that is corrupted beyond anything we can imagine. As for this topic of Homosexuality, they have believed a lie from the father of lies as has everyone who does not call Yeshua Lord.

      Shalom my beloved and Maranatha

  28. mark huss said

    If I just read the point of the pastor described in the cover article I would have to say the pastor’s point was well taken.
    In a few years the homosexuals would simply die off. Why? They cannot procreate. What they do is perverse and outside of God’s created order.
    Human anatomy tells us this. Ultimately the conclusion is that a homosexual is a person who has chosen to violate God’s created order.

    I’m tired of Christians cow towing to the popular thoughts of the world or even other so-called Christian leaders who may have an electronic platform. Here, we have a pastor with some courage. It’s easy to bad mouth his intentions. Has any heard his message? I’m sick of the homosexual agenda. The pastor made a very good point. Can we not see the forest through the trees?

    I would believe that this pastor most likely had in his heart the desire to see anyone involved in this perverse lifestyle saved.

    I have read Mr. Marzulli’s comments and I think his comments are in fact inflammatory against this pastor. Rather than making comments viral on the web if he was so offended maybe a conversation in private with the pastor should have taken place.

    • Kelly said

      Wow. Really Mark? And can you cast a stone because you are without sin? is your life squeaky clean and can pass the litmus test? I don’t know about you but I need a savior myself. Love is the answer. You can love without accepting. But if you have not love what good are your opinions? My daughter is gay. I will not give up on her and put her in some kind of “pen.” But I will pray for her until the day I die. Every day. Every hour I can think of it. I will pray and I will pray and I will pray. And I will love. Nobody comes to the Father unless the Spirit draws him. We are in a world with darkness and sin. Pray. We eat toxic food. Pray. Birds are born with 3 beaks. Pray. People are eating each other. Pray. And there is homosexuality. Pray. My daughter is not just one of “them.” She has a name. Jesus died for her and even though the days are short, there is hope. 1 Corinthians 13: 1-10. Love keeps going to the end. Not until we are all just “sick and tired.”

    • Elaine said

      AMEN to that Kelly!!!!!!!

    • lamarzulli said

      Kelly _ I agree 100%.

    • Elaine said

      so how do you feel about Westboro Baptist? Same thing, different day!

    • Matt said

      Here is the rub ” be rounded up, put in a fenced in area and left to die out”
      No Christian should want to see a human being die without coming to the Lord, no matter what the sin is.
      Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God
      This NOT a pastor with courage, no, I say he is a pastor filled with hate in his heart.
      Years ago if this same pastor said, anyone into that evil satanic heavy metal music should be rounded up and left to die, I would never have found the Lord. I’m blessed that God sent someone to me with a loving and forgiving heart to tell me no matter what I had done, and I did a lot, things I dare not tell mommy and daddy, that those sins could be washed away, and I could be made like new again…and my heart cried out for that.

      2 Peter 3:9 tells us, The Lord will be patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.

      Mark 2:17 When Jesus heard it, he said to them, “Those who are well have no need of a physician, but those who are sick. I came not to call the righteous, but sinners Romans 5:8 ESV / 4 helpful votes

      Romans 5:8 But God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.

      If this pastor holds the same beliefs for Christian men that are addicted to porn, those “camps” would be filled to the brim….ah yes, porn, the churches dirty little secret that is not supposed to be talked about lest we lose memberships. A sin that can be done anonymously in the shadows, away from the prying eyes but not away from Gods eyes. Porn is an epidemic in the church, so to say this Pastor is brave to say this about homosexuals, and he should step up and include all sexual sin, fornication, lust, perversion. Sexual sin is rampant in churches today and incudes some of the church leaders. As I said, porn is a sin committed in the shadows, away from family, pastors, spouses and it’s destroying lives and marriages by the thousands which Is exactly what Satan has intended.
      Some folks in the church are in sexual sin however, they are more concerned with the so called the threat of homosexuals, a witch hunt if you will.

      Matthew 7:5 “You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother’s eye.

    • Elaine said

      Yea Matt!!!!

    • Amen Matt. Pornography does more damage to morals, our families and the body of Christ than the impositions of the gay and lesbian community ever could. It’s all unrighteousness.

    • mark huss said

      Baal Peor… people should read and learn about the demonic influence relative to homosexuality before casting their stones at me.

      So with all this talk of my life having to be squeaky clean and casting the first stone I’m wondering how many of you have your love stones in hand ready to fire at me regarding my comments?

      Were my comments even read? I said the pastor most likely wanted these people to be saved. I don’t know the man. I only read the story as it was posted. Everyone’s comments regarding what I said is spot on to the conclusion I represented.

      I was saved years ago. I had more sin in my life than I would ever want to own up to. Drafted into the war in Vietnam I have memories of every form of human abasement that you could ever imagine. My need for a Savior was indeed great but no greater than the child who stole a cookie from the cookie jar. Both of us needed salvation as do all men everywhere.

      The pastor’s point is still well taken. Homosexuality is a choice to live a life of perverse sin. There is no genetic makeup for homosexuality. A person chooses to follow the direction of a demon into a counter, anti-creation, anti-God lifestyle. It is only by the grace of God that any with sin make it out of this mess we are all in.

      As for your daughter, I hope she finds the Lord Jesus Christ as I do for my own lost daughter.

    • Matt said

      Man, I not judging you, you stated your opinion and you are entitled to that opinion. If someone has a different view or opinion than you it does not mean they are judging you. Not many on here agree with my post, I don’t take it personal, just a difference in opinion. I don’t feel they are judging me. They are just misguided… :)
      No big deal, I have heard all points of view that pretty much run the gamut of your view and everything in between. My point was these people that the pastor wants to let die off are human beings the Lord still loves dearly despite the sin they are living in. It is his wish to see them set free and saved from their darkness, not killed in their sin to spend eternity in hell separated from his love.
      I’m just surprised that you bring up the point that you “had more sin in my life than I would ever want to own up to and have memories of every form of human abasement that you could ever imagine” but yet homosexuals seem to rise you so badly. If you have seen and witness all this sin why does homosexuals rile you up so much? Surely gays are not the worst thing you have even seen? Do you feel the same about pedophiles or do they get a free pass?

    • mark huss said

      The pastor used an analogy that I thought spoke to the issue of secular teaching that is being forced upon all of us. That being that homosexuality is a genetic condition that predisposes some to a homosexual lifestyle. Thus the pastors analogy.

      I doubt the pastor wants to kill off any person that has decided to practice this lifestyle. If you doubt me why don’t we let Mr. Marzulli ask the pastor and them we will all find out. My comments were discussing the analogy without knowing the pastor or listening to his message.

      God will judge homosexuality and those who practice it. Sodom and Gommorah and a number of other biblical references like Romans chapter one will surely tell you this. Homosexuality is significantly different than a childs lie to a parent. It is a perverse reversal of the created order of God. Homosexuality is a sin. Lying is a sin. Adultery is sin. Eating someone is a sin. We all violate God’s moral code on a daily basis. Yet there are practices by men and women that will secure a much harsher judgement from God.

      Since homosexuality is a gross violation of God’s created order its judgement will be far more severe. Do we not
      realize God will put homosexuals into hell fire forever? There has been a lot of talk of God’s love. Precious little of God’s judgement.

      I have now read that the pastor has been in ministry for 52 years. He is I believe 72 years old. I’m thankful for
      faithfulness in ministry. His or anyone else’s. If the analogy offends so many of you why don’t you ask Mr. Marzulli to get to the bottom of this?

      Homosexuality is a choice to live a life that is anti-God, anti-created order, filthy, and will be judged by God severely. “God is not mocked, whatsoever a man soweth that shall he also reap”.

      The world tells all Christians everywhere to be tolerant and not to offend anyone. Paul said that he was not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God unto salvation. Those captured by demonic influence that are participating in gross violations of God’s created order need God’s power for salvation as do all sinners. However, not all participate in gross violations of God’s created order, do they? Stop letting the secular world drive your knowledge of Scripture.

      I would call upon Mr. Marzulli to investigate this episode and get to the bottom of all this discourse. It is easy to inflame rhetoric. Lets find out if all the accusations by Christians against another Christian (the pastor) are correct?

    • Matt said

      I feel incest and pedophiles are also a gross violation of God’s created order as well and to be honest I feel it is far more severe than homosexuals. Incest and pedophiles destroy young lives. I do not want to debate the degree of these sins as they are all equal in the eyes of God, man puts degrees or severity on sin.
      I’m taking Pontius Pilate’s advice and washing my hands of this mess.
      We all have difference if opinions, it’s what makes the world go around, I’m sure we will all debate this again at some point , but I grow weary of this subject matter at this time, it depresses me and brings my spirit down and I wish to put it to rest. I hope and pray you work this out.

    • mark huss said

      Matt:

      It does not matter what you feel should be considered violations of God’s created order. God has already told you what is a violation of His created order and He has clearly put His position on paper for you to read. God’s word is very specific. What matters is that you believe what God has written in the Scripture.

      Taking the advice of a pagan worshiping unbeliever and washing your hands of this mess is not sound.

      I have nothing to work out. I know what the Scripture teaches. I suggest you do the same.

    • mark huss said

      To Elaine:
      Westboro Baptist Church? Are you attempting to connect me to this church because of my comment? Shame on you. You don’t even know me.

      To Kelly:
      I’m without sin? Shame on you. You don’t even know me.

      Before you (as well as Mr. Marzulli) put me in the cross hairs of judgement for my comments maybe you should ask and not be so quick to judge my thoughts or motives. Sounds like a proper Christian perspective to me.

      Christians are the only people I know of that are more than eager to destroy and criticize their own. Be careful how your heart turns. It may turn on you.

    • Elaine said

      To Mark Huss: If you look back at my comment, it was a question asking what you think about Westboro…..and it was not directed specifically to you…….granted it was meant as a loaded question for ALL in this debate but I guess your defensive reply here tells us your answer! Did that question sting a little? Sorry.
      Maybe you have put anyone who does not fully agree with you in crosshairs? Shame on you….you don’t know any of us!!!!!!!!
      Might I suggest you take the following advice?….
      Christians are the only people I know of that are more than eager to destroy and criticize their own. Be careful how your heart turns. It may turn on you.

    • mark huss said

      Elaine:

      Believe me I’ve taken my own advice.

      I have no associations with the church you referenced.

      What is it about my original comment that motivated you to imply an association with that church?

      Where have I asked anyone to agree with me?

      Agree with God and the Scripture.

    • Elaine said

      again….I tossed the question out for general response because the suggestion that Christians take judgement into their own hands and put the gays in a concentration camp reminds me of the Westboro group….why do you feel like that is an attack on you?

    • mark huss said

      Elaine:

      I’ve been attacked before and I certainly don’t think anyone is attacking me.
      Judgement belongs to the Lord. Vengence belongs to the Lord.
      This pastor was not suggesting any be put into a concentration camp. He is not advocating death to homosexuals either.
      He is making a point that counters the teaching of secular man (psychology, psychaiatry, geneticists, television anchors, pundits and politicians and others who are constantly trying to make the case that homosexuality is genetic). Homosexuality is not genetic. What is being said from those secularists is that heterosexuals have
      offspring that are homosexual. If you don’t believe me watch Anderson Coopers interview with a woman from that church.
      The pastor’s point is homosexuals cannot reproduce themselves. The only way to justify homosexuality is to convince everyone that homosexuality is in fact genetic.
      God’s word tells us that unbelieving man will be judged according to their works.

    • lamarzulli said

      Hi Mark – Let me jump in here. The pastor was quoted as saying that he would round all the gays and lesbians and put a fence around them. If that is accurate and I believe it is, then that is essentially a concentration camp. It’s unconscionable to think that anyone would say this in the 21st century, but here we have a pastor spewing the same type of vitriol that started the Holocaust in Nazi Germany.

    • Matt said

      Mark, I also take advice from Gandhi, Confucius, and other world renowned leaders and intelligent men and women of history. That’s just ignorant not to take advice from great minds just because they are not of the same faith as you. There is good advice given by non Christians,to say there is not is to be foolish and blind.
      Johann Wolfgang von Goethe a non-Christian and a great mind. He is considered the supreme genius of modern literature. His works span the fields of poetry, drama, prose, philosophy, and science (in particular the fields of botany, anatomy, geology and optics) His advice “One ought, every day at least, to hear a little song, read a good poem, see a fine picture, and if it were possible, speak a few reasonable words” I believe this is good sound advice from a non Christian, a “pagan worshiping unbeliever” in your eyes I would assume.
      I don’t see your point with Pontius Pilate, he does not seem like an ignorant man to me. How could he be when he found no fault with Jesus?

      “I am innocent of the blood of this just person; see ye to it”
      Pontius Pilate

      “Ye have brought this man unto me, as one that perverteth the people; and behold, I, having examined him before you, have found no fault in this man touching those things whereof ye accuse him”
      Pontius Pilate

    • gerie said

      Mark, I understand what you are saying, you’re not alone, I agree with you, brother. Lets pray for Pastor Worley, you and I, because thats what Jesus would want. We know in our hearts what he meant. Its not so easy for him, and many of us, to live side by side with sin as these others. There is a very real vexing of the spirit, that we can feel. Worley condemned the Presidents decision. I agree with him. I believe that we have all somehow, become too comfortable around sin. Way too loving for our own good, even to the point of having homosexual friends come to our homes, influencing our family in an unconscious way, that their sin isn’t so bad and to become comfotable around it.
      Paul said, “Have no fellowship with the unrighteous works of darkness, but rather reprove them. Reprove means to cause them to feel shame. That’s a command in scripture. Thats the word of God! Do we just remove it? This scripture speaks directly to the situation we’re talking about, yet we rather have pity on them and reprove the Pastor and make him feel shame, who is working for God. No one is interested in watching the second video I mentioned, but have already condemned Worley almost as if he has committed the unpardonable sin. God loves Pastor Worley and so do I. I can tell you that his reward will be great.
      When he was preaching He illustrated his point by trying to demonstrate the way he saw the evilness of sin, in his own words, that we need to be separate, but he never meant it to be taken literally. Anybody knows that! Even the press knows that. They’re just using the opportunity to further their agenda. When he used his illustration, he wasn’t thinking that it sounded like the Holocaust! How about condemning the person who actually loaded the video up on you tube for the purpose of causing trouble? Funny, that isn’t even mentioned. Not even here!
      There are still some of us left who are not so tolerant, and want to teach our children and neighbors and friends that this behavior is NOT normal, but vile.The word of God agrees with us. The reason that homosexuality is getting so much attention more than other sins right now, is because they are trying to change marriage and other laws, profaning our military and are working hard for their sin to be accepted and perceived as normal. Adulterers aren’t doing that. We can all see how they are pushing there way into every area of our lives, that before used to be off limits from their evil influence.
      And these people, instead of marching boldly in gay pride parades ought to be made to feel ashamed through our preaching against it from every single pulpit in America! Thats our God given job! Certainly they should not be made to feel, accepted or “normal” The Bible says that God gave them up… (Rom 1:26) that says a lot. He gave them up to vile affections. Vile means disgraceful, self-disparagement. In other words, behavior that would cause them to feel internal shame as well as outward shame. Should we fight against God in trying to make them feel accepted and comfortable in their sins. The Lord is dealing with them and we ought to agree with the Holy Spirit who is internally convicting them of sin. And not going out of our way to make them feel normal. Gods word says they are not!
      Pastor Worley didn’t pick the best choice of words he could have used, but who of us is perfect, should cast the first stone. I understand how that the secular world would pounce on him, but not us? Not his brothers and sisters in Christ? Why are we so quick to accuse him, without knowing more? Who of us would want to be judged by a two minute video clip? And when he tries to explain that he loves the homosexual in the second video, we refuse to hear him. Would Jesus do that?!
      Jesus left us a new commandment, and that is to love one another. But we rather love and protect Gods enemies than our own brother! This is still so shocking to me and is my own personal wake up call to the times we are living in. Brother will deliver brother up it says… Now I can actually see that happening, for those who deliver us up will think they are doing Gods will. Just like Saul. Lets don’t deceive ourselves. We will be held accountable for speaking against our brother, and joining forces with the world to accuse him. And consequently, unwittingly, we have also raised the bar on how we ourselves will be judged. Because you have all condemned Worley for a poor choice of words, while he was doing his best, working for God, from now on, you all will be held to the same standard, unless you repent. Judge not, remember? I have never seen such coldness, and cut and dried condemnation with no possibility for redemption,as towards this man but only the deed is done you say, and he is accused and guilty. Case closed. So will you all be judged, and when you look for mercy, the same amount you gave to Pastor Worley will be measured back to each one of you.They have made him the most hated Pastor in America, and you all have helped their cause, by your rhetoric.
      Brothers and sisters we are better than this. The love and sympathy you have towards the homosexual, would be much appreciated by Pastor Worley right now. When one of us is hurting, we all feel the pain. We are all members of one body. Please pray for Pastor Worley and show God that you love him too. Much more than those who are Gods enemies, right now. There is love enough for everybody. Please remember him in your prayers, God needs you all to pray for him. God bless you all.

    • Hopeful_watcher said

      I’d like to cut to the heart of this matter and take the fire out of the debate. I said some of this down below, but I will say it again. For the sake of argument, I will accept what Gerie and Mark Huss have said. I’ll summarize here just so we are on the same page. I’ll accept what Gerie said that Pastor Worley did not actually condone such an action as rounding up gays. I’ll accept Mark Huss’s view that he was actually trying to undermine the view that homosexuality is genetic, which secular culture is pushing down our throats. That bothers me too. I’ll accept that Pastor Worley is a good dedicated man of God who deserves our respect and love. And no one here is disputing what the scriptures say about the practice of homosexuality.

      With all that said, Pastor Worley should not have used such words or tactics that he used. I’ll support him as a Pastor to retract such language and extend love to him, but I won’t support what he said as it stands. As a pastor you need a bit of pragmatism. You need to know that your words are a tool to bring honor and glory to God. This applies to all Christians really. Every word we use on this forum should bring honor and glory to God. From a purely pragmatic view, Pastor Worley’s comments did not succeed in that. If he had a problem with the “born this way” argument, then he should have tackled it head on. He could have said, “Many in the homosexual community believe that homosexuality is a genetic trait. I take umbrage with that. If that were true, then the genetic trait of homosexuality would have died out through the years, because these genes would not be passed on.” But the good Pastor instead used hyperbole and rhetoric to make his point. We all should say what we mean and mean what we say. These oratory devices have no use on the pulpit, because they draw attention to the speaker’s view and away from giving the honor and glory to God. How can I say that? Because we are here debating about the speaker and not what the scriptures say about homosexuality. His choice of words has divided the body of Christ on this topic.

      Colossians 3:13 Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you. 14 And over all these virtues put on love, which binds them all together in perfect unity.
      15 Let the peace of Christ rule in your hearts, since as members of one body you were called to peace. And be thankful.

      It’s also inflamed those in the secular community against Christians on this matter. This is GOING to happen anyway, of course, but let’s let our scorn and persecution be against Jesus and His saving grace and not a side show based on some poorly chosen words from a Pastor. You can only assume that the pastor was attempting to be inflammatory here by using an illustration that raises up the hackles of the public. Let the words of Christ be inflammatory!! Not some illustration we use to try and drive home a point. When it’s the words of Christ that are what is inflammatory, then people must choose Christ or not Christ and their hearts are convicted. But when it’s our own words that are inflammatory, then there is no conviction of the spirit. Satan is laughing with delight.

      Lastly, we must use the word of God as a sword to defend the faith. Too often we use the word as a guillotine to enforce our views.

    • Elaine said

      Amen

    • mark huss said

      To HopefulWatcher, LA Marzulli, Gerrie, and others thank you for your comments.
      While I have not discussed the words used by this pastor, anyone, myself included, can use words that are inappropriate. I do not know how many times this man has spoken during the many years he has been in the pastorate but I would assume every now and then he probably wishes that he would have said something different, or used better words to communicate his point.

      The interview by Anderson Cooper with a woman from this church in revealing. I would encourage all to watch it and learn what Anderson Cooper is attempting to promote. I would also encourage all to study the history of the worship of Baal Peor.

      One other comment to MATT. I do not learn from secularists, they have nothing to teach me as a born again, new creation in Christ Jesus, where my mind in continually being transformed from the stupidity of secular thought into the mind of Christ. As to Pilate being a great man full of wisdom? He was a coward, afraid of the Jews who wanted to murder Jesus Christ. He had authority to release Jesus as an innocent man, but rather capitulated to the mob that he was afraid of and had an innocent man executed. This is what he (Pilate) washed his hands from.

    • Mark,

      The Apostle Paul would disagree with you. He quoted at least three secular poets in his writings.

      Aratus-Acts 17:28

      This poem that Paul quotes is the “Phaenomena” by Aratus, the oldest and best-known poem of Greek astronomy. Aratus is the source for all the classical Greek constellations, which are still used to the present day. Aratus is also an excellent classical source for other aspects of astronomy, including the phases of the moon, the changes of the seasons, and cloud patterns that forecast changes in the weather. Paul quotes from the beginning of Aratus’s Phaenomena:

      “From Zeus let us begin; him do we mortals never leave unnamed; full of Zeus are all the streets and all the market places of men; full is the sea and the havens thereof; always we all have need of Zeus. For we are also his offspring; and he in his kindness unto men giveth favorable signs and wakeneth the people to work, reminding them of livelihood.”

      In quoting from Aratus, and Cleanthes, it appears that the Apostle Paul was well-versed in the Greek classical astronomy! Paul goes on to explain in his sermon on Mars Hill that it is God, not Zeus, who the Athenians should worship:

      “Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man’s device. And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men everywhere to repent.” (Acts 17:29, 30)

      From Epimenides to advise Titus in Titus 1:12

      For example, take the lines of Epimenides, quoted by Paul in Titus 1:12:

      Liars ever, men of Crete, Savage brutes that live to eat.

      The meaning seems clear: Paul’s opponents in Crete — were false teachers — who have sunk to the level of brute beasts, unrestrained in their brutality, always searching for their prey. In quoting a Cretan poet, Paul underscores the authority of his own judgment without exposing himself to the charge of being prejudice against Cretans. We can compare this with the same statement in prose:

      Cretans are always liars, evil brutes, and lazy gluttons.

      Menander -1 Cor. 15:33

      Quoting the Greek playwright Menander, he strongly exhorted the Corinthians to be careful of their associations. Do not be misled: Bad company corrupts good character. (1 Cor. 15:33). The playwright Menander, in a fragment, said “I call a fig a fig, a spade a spade.

      More… “http://www.angelfire.com/adazio/page45.html”

      Have you ever heard the old saying that even a broken clock is right twice a day? Well, you may want to reconsider your opinion in light of this.

      You have forgotten that truth is what created this planet and even secularists will recognize it on occasion.

    • Matt said

      Dear brother you have a closed mind and are blinded by ideology and shackled by religion. That is such a shame…however, to each his own, I feel that’s a shallow way to live a life and it certainly won’t get you to heaven any faster. Good luck carrying that chip on your shoulder, must be a heavy burden it bear. (Pssst…Jesus carried those burden for you on Calvary, you really don’t need to)
      You know full well Pilate could not possibly release Jesus even if he wanted to; the decision was set in stone. Prophecy could not have been fulfilled if he released him, by his actions of washing his hands of innocent blood I believe the curse that would have fell upon the Romans was passed.
      Even you, even you sir, being a scholar of the bible should know Pilate could not have possibly release Jesus.

      “I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ.” Gandhi

      .

    • Even Jesus, who called to Saul of Tarsus three times and asked why he was persecuting Him, quoted a secular playwrite.

      Acts 26:14—“And when we were all fallen to the earth, I heard a voice speaking unto me, and saying in the Hebrew tongue, Saul, Saul, why persecutest thou me? it is hard for thee to kick against the pricks.” The phrase “kick against the pricks” “comes from Aeschylus (525–456 b.c.; Agamemnon, line 1624). Believers do not usually think of the Lord Jesus appearing in glory to convert an apostle, and quoting a line from Greek poetry!” (Witness to Christ, p. 364).

      More… “http://www.bjupress.com/resources/articles/t2t/christian-and-secular-literature.php”

    • mark huss said

      To Rose from Kentucky and Matt:
      Colossians 2:3-4 “In whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge. And this I say, lest any man should beguile you with enticing words”.
      Colossians 2:8-10 “Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world and not after Christ. For in Him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily. And ye are complete in him which is the head of all pricipality and power”.
      Colossians 3:2 “Set your affections on things above, not on things on the earth” The Apostle Paul

      To Rose: “A broken clock is still broken” Mark Huss

      To Matt: Yes I’m schackled, but to the Lord Jesus Christ. Forever thankful.

      To both of you. “Truth exposes error.” However, compromise embraces error, then it accomadates error, then it knowingly allows error, then it openly practices error”. Mark Huss

    • Mark, I hope you realize that you’re using Scripture to argue against Scripture and your argument has strayed into the absurd.

    • lamarzulli said

      Mark – I have tried to contact Pastor Worley but he won’t talk to the media. On another note, a child stood up in his church and sang, ain’t no homo gonna make it to heaven. Perhaps we should start passing out pink stars to the LGBT community and pass laws against them. Then we can round them up and put them in the concentration camps and gas them. Hate speech is hate speech and while I have said very plainly that homosexuality is sin, and I certainly don’t condone it, we must understand that if Jesus were walking here, they would be the people He would hang out with, in my opinion. But wait! Jesus is here because those of us who are born again can witness to these folks. What a concept.

    • mark huss said

      L.A.Marzulli:
      I want you to know that I apprecaite your attempt to dialogue with this man. This encourages me much in the Lord. Thank you.
      I’m saddened to hear of this report. You are correct regarding our testimony. We are to be involved with the unbelievers of this world as the Lord was. We do speak for the Lord. Again, Thank you. Mark Huss

      Rose I shared the Word of God with you. Your arguement is not with me, it is with the Lord. If I’m guilty of being absurd for believing God’s word then so be it and I will wear that badge of honor.

    • Mark,

      Are you going to completely disregard the Scripture I shared with you? I proved your point wrong from the mouths of both Jesus and Paul.

      Your arrogance is difficult to bear.

      If Jesus were on earth now, He would be hanging out with those people you condone being herded into a camp, and he would be blasting people like you who have made the gospel a bludgeoning stick and something to be feared instead of the highway to grace that God intended for it to be.

    • mark huss said

      Rose:

      My point stands the test for Biblical Truth. Your dislike of my position on casting away human philosophy, human reason, so-called human wisdom, Greek mythology, poetry, etc. is consistent with the Scriptural teaching to stay away from it. Your arguement is with God not me.

      Arrogance? I choose to believe what God teaches. If arrogance is my lable for believing this, then it becomes a badge of honor for me as well.

      Do I condone people being herded into a camp?
      Jesus would be blasting people like me who make the gospel a bludgeoning stick?
      I have made the gospel into something to be feared?

      How have I done all this?

    • lamarzulli said

      Mark – Grace and mercy. When the woman who was caught in adultery was brought in front of Jesus, what did He do with her? “Where are your accusers? Go and sin no more!” That’s the essence of grace. She was guilty, she deserved to die. If we don’t understand grasp what grace is we are nothing more than modern day pharisees clinging to what we think religion is supposed to be.

    • mark huss said

      L.A.

      Grace, unmerited favor.

      I receive His salvation by faith in the finished work of Jesus Christ on the cross. All who come to Him will in no wise be cast out.
      I believe in God’s grace. I believe in His mercy. I have received His salvation.
      I agree with your thoughts on the adulterous woman. As a child of the King I can do no less.

      As I grow in Christ the source of all I know and would ever want for my spiritual life is found in the Word of God. I learned a long time ago that religion is man’s attempt to know God. Christianity is God’s attempt to know man.

      For the record. I do not want any homosexual put into any camp where they would be systematically eliminated, by whatever means, by some barbaric Christian zealot. Thanks for following this correspondence. Mark Huss

    • mark huss said

      To Rose:

      The fact that the learned Apostle Paul used pagan, ungodly, Stoic philosophers and their writings to prove to them the unworthiness of their ridiculous beliefs is not a proof text for believers anywhere to be students of any humanistic philosophers of today or even of the past. God’s word says to stay away from the input of these deceivers. For example:

      Let us begin with Zeus, whom we mortals never leave unspoken.

      For every street, every market-place is full of Zeus.

      Even the sea and the harbour are full of this deity.

      Everywhere everyone is indebted to Zeus.

      For we are indeed his offspring… (Phaenomena 1-5).

      It is noteworthy that Aratus commences his poem with the words, “let us begin with Zeus,” for the gods who were conventionally invoked by Greek poets were the Muses, the goddesses of poetic inspiration. Aratus’ contemporaries would have been struck by this change, by which the poet lends a religious Stoic tenor into the Phaenomena. To ancient Greeks Zeus was the sky-god whose control over the sun and clouds directly concerned human beings. For Hellenistic Stoics, however, Zeus was another name for that force which controlled the universe and resided in man and beast. It is a kind of pantheism which Aratus advances in these opening lines: the divine Reason permeates every facet of human endeavour. The city-streets and market-places, the seas and harbours are filled with the presence of this deity (lines 2-3). Zeus must be praised at the start of his poem because this “world-soul” controls the cosmos. Mankind is, according to such belief, part of that environment and so “is indebted to Zeus.” The omnipotence of Zeus is expressed with the words “for we are indeed his offspring.” Literally the poet states that we are of the race (genos) of Zeus. Thus the ancient weather-god, once depicted in anthropomorphic terms, is replaced by the Stoics with an abstract force which pervades the entire world. Having noted the context of the half-verse “for we are indeed his offspring,” the reader will conclude that the apostle Paul does not quote this passage in complete agreement with its meaning and intent, but in order to show that even to some Greek thinkers and writers the idea of an anthropomorphic Zeus is false. Bravo to the Apostle Paul.

      It still is not the permission slip to the church to pursue the worthless, empty teachings of philosophers or any others in this realm.

    • And yet, despite all that, both Paul and Jesus used their words. And Jesus did it from His throne. Hmmm…

    • mark huss said

      To Rose:

      Jesus was on the throne when He told His church to stay away from the teachings of men. Like I said it’s up to you to believe His word.

    • Matt said

      “Jesus was on the throne when He told His church to stay away from the teachings of men”

      Then I guess getting a high school and or college education is all for naught? What Jesus meant was teachings of false religions not common knowledge we need to survive this planet, geez, if we took your interpretation of the scriptures we would sill be in the Stone Age.

    • mark huss said

      Matt:

      Very interesting reply. You are the one is upholds wisdom from false religions and teachers. Confucius, Ghandi: and secular philosophers like Goethe. I should not have to state the obvious but, “of course I believe that a non-Christian math teacher can teach me two plus two equals four”. That is not the point. The Scripture gives you strong admonition, in fact commands you, to feed your soul on the Scripture not on the words, advice, wisdom. philosophy, reason or anything else from secular thinkers and even Christian thinkers so-called who bring humanistic reason into the word of God from those who know not God.

      For your information and learning:

      Hegelian dialectics is being used around the world as a tool to break down traditional beliefs with the objective of replacing them with something new.

      Georg Wilhelm Hegel (1770-1831) was a liberal German philosopher who led the German Idealist movement, turning his back on orthodox Christianity and holding to a type of pantheism. He denied that there is such a thing as absolute truth. He said it is “narrow” and “dogmatic” to assume that of two opposite assertions, one must be true and the other false. He rejected the Bible and proposed that man is on an evolutionary journey and that human history is the record of a process of conflict and synthesis that he referred to as the dialectical process of Spirit, believing that man would eventually reach his highest state, ultimately arriving at “the Absolute Idea” which would be so perfect it could not be challenged or synthesized.

      The Hegelian system is described as follows:

      “It was Hegel’s view that all things unfold in a continuing evolutionary process whereby each idea or quality (the THESIS) inevitably brings forth its opposite (the ANTITHESIS). From that interaction, a third state emerges in which the opposites are integrated, overcome, and fulfilled in a richer and higher SYNTHESIS. This synthesis then becomes the basis for another dialectical process of opposition and synthesis. Hegel believed that the creative stress of opposing positions was essential for developing higher states of consciousness. In the moment of synthesis, the opposites are both preserved and transcended, negated and fulfilled” (Corinne McLaughlin and Gordon Davidson, Spiritual Politics, 1994, p. 88).

      Hegel believed that this process has a life of its own, in an evolutionary sense, but since the days of Karl Marx and Frederick Engels it has been used as a guided process toward a desired end.

      The objective of Hegelian dialectics in this sense is to replace something old with something new (e.g., capitalism with communism, traditional Bible doctrine with theological modernism, a traditional educational system based on moral absolutes with a new one based on relativism, an old age with a new).

      Used like this, Hegelian dialectics cannot produce the new thing, but it can destroy the old. Other processes and techniques come into play in actually producing the new thing that is desired.

      Hegelian dialectics is used today to create a “paradigm shift” by replacing an old “paradigm” (prevailing belief system) with a new one. It is a technique of “social evolution” and “political transcendence.”

      It is not an innocent process. It is used by “change agents” and “facilitators of transformation.” Hegelian dialectics is “the framework for guiding our thoughts and actions into conflicts that lead us to a predetermined solution”.

      Speaking religiously and spiritually, it is an ever-evolving system that never arrives at absolute truth. All is relative and negotiable and the end justifies the means.

      It employs a wide range of tactics: dialogue, compromise, consensus forming, conflict resolution, divide and conquer, deceit, redefinition of words, giving new names to objectionable things, crisis creation, obfuscation (concealment of meaning by making something confusing and hard to interpret or by otherwise hiding its true meaning).

      It requires non-judgmentalism, tolerance, acceptance, relativism, group mentality.

      It is the opposite of and the avowed enemy of dogmatism, absolutism, exclusivism, and separatism.

      It is very elitist and complex.

      HEGELIAN DIALECTICS IS EMPLOYED BY COMMUNISTS to tear down law-based capitalistic, democratic societies that grant the right to private ownership of property and replace them with communist ones. Karl Marx and Frederick Engels’ take on the Hegelian philosophy is called “dialectical materialism,” because it focuses on the evolution of economics (materialism) rather than the spirit, as in Hegel’s system. In older communist terms the thesis was CAPITALISM and the antithesis was the PROLETARIAT (workers exploited at the hands of owners and the capitalistic system in general who rise up in resistance). The process of conflict and resolution is supposed to continue until it produces the ultimate synthesis which is allegedly pure communism but in reality is a New World Order of severe communitarianism (collectivism, the politics of community, the individual cared for by the state while his individuality is subservient to the will of society).

      HEGELIAN DIALECTICS HAS BEEN EMPLOYED BY EDUCATORS in America since the 1920s to move the educational system from the old concept of moral absolutism and submission to a higher authority to the new philosophy of relativism and constant change. “The collective moulding begins early in life, sustained and refined throughout one’s formal education; a universal curriculum of manipulation can transform and achieve a complete paradigm shift for a whole generation”. The influence of the New Age public school system is incalculable.

      HEGELIAN DIALECTICS IS EMPLOYED BY THE EMERGING CHURCH to break down the old church “paradigm” so that it can be replaced with the emerging one.

      HEGELIAN DIALECTICS IS EMPLOYED BY ECUMENISTS to break down the walls of separation between denominations, between liberals and evangelicals, between Protestants and Catholics, to create Christian unity, and it is used BY INTERFAITH DIALOGUERS to tear down absolute truth and replace it with broadminded religious tolerance.

      From a biblical perspective Hegelian dialectics is gross disobedience to God.

      Hegelian dialectics is contrary to the Bible’s teaching that we have been given absolute truth from God and we are not to allow any contradiction. The Bible claims to be the sole divine revelation that God has given mankind and we are to believe it and judge everything by it (2 Timothy 3:16-17). We are to allow “no other doctrine” (1 Timothy 1:3). We are to “earnestly contend for the faith which was once delivered to the saints” (Jude 3), which means we are forbidden to give contradictory doctrines any credence.

      For the Bible believer, the Bible is THE infallible thesis, and every antithesis is to be rejected and no synthesis allowed!

      Hegelian dialectics is contrary to the Bible’s teaching that God’s people are to separate from darkness.

      “Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offences contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them” (Romans 16:17).

      “Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness? And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel? And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you” (2 Corinthians 6:14-17).

      “Having a form of godliness, but denying the power thereof: from such turn away” (2 Timothy 3:5).

      “And we know that we are of God, and the whole world lieth in wickedness. And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life. Little children, keep yourselves from idols. Amen” (1 John 5:19-21).

      The Bible asks rhetorically, “Can two walk together, except they be agreed?” (Amos 3:3). The Ecumenical, New Age, Emerging Church crowd brazenly replies, “Sure, we can make that work.”

      But it won’t work. It never has and it never will.

      Well does the Bible describe the great departure of the faith as those who are “ever learning, and never able to come to the knowledge of the truth” (2 Timothy 3:7).

    • Matt said

      There you go again with religion; you must forgive me as I am NOT religious. So your responses to me leave me a bit baffled to the point I am being to question your sanity. You said in your post “You are the one is upholds wisdom from false religions and teachers” My doctor happens to be Jewish, not a Christian, so should I not listen to his wisdom when it comes to my health?
      “Sorry Doc you are not a Christian so I really can’t listen to anything you say” (as I’m so insecure with my Lord and myself you might say something to lead me astray)
      Listen man, I am confident enough in my walk with Christ that I don’t feel threatened or offended by someone of a different faith to give me their opinion or wisdom. I personally know a 96 year old Native American woman. Lived her whole life on the reservation and off the grid. She has so much wisdom in her, so much to teach a younger generation about life and how to live off the land. Should I not listen to her wisdom because she is not a Christian?
      She has way more wisdom in her little toe than this entire two bit pastor you are trying to defend. Just because I might listen to someone’s opinion on life does not mean I am “yoked together” with that person, I’m not marrying them or having a relationship with them…. you can’t be blinded by Satan enough to seriously believe that? Can you? Really? If so then you are in bondage and Satan has blinded you, and has all wrapped up in all this religious legalese. You are like the Pharisees, self-righteousness, smug with moral superiority derived from strong misguided religious convictions that lead nowhere.
      You are just a closed minded fellow that in my opinion gives a bad name to Christianity. When I witness and try to lead folks to Christ, the number one reason they refuse or resist is because of so called small minded, bigoted judgmental Christians like yourself. I will pray for you though brother. I will pray the Lord will bind Satan off your life, open your eyes and set you free.
      FYI….Quoting scripture does not impress me; the devil himself can quote scripture.

    • Matt said

      By the way I’m done with this, I will not respond to anymore post on this thread or subject. This is not pleasing to God. And I sense Satan has his hand on this, working through someone to cause strife.
      He thrives off confusion and bickering, and I will not play into his hand as tempting as it is. I respect Dr Marzulli’s work and his blog and this is the reason I held back and will not soil or devalue it with backbiting and controversy over Gods word. We all heard your opinion and thoughts on the subject and we know where you stand, lets leave it like that before it gets any worse than it already is.
      I look foward to your other comments on different subjects on the fourm in the future and as is said I will pray for you…God Bless

    • mark huss said

      Matt:

      The difference is . . .

      The Devil does not submit to Scripture, I do.

      I quoted Scripture for your benefit and edification. I also attempted to show you how many are deceived by embracing the Hegelian Dialetic. Embracing knowledge (from other humans) for practical living skills e.g. dressing a wound, raising an animal, farming, fishing, hunting, self defense, flying the space shuttle, being an engineer, builder, race car driver, orthopedic surgeon, etc. requires knowledge. Anyone can teach practical knowledge, a Christian or non-Christian. That was my point about a non-Christian math teacher teaching me that two plus two equals four.

      When it comes to earthly wisdom, the Bible is clear. Stay away from it. It is up to you to submit.

      Let me give you an example of the deceit you have already embraced.

      You quoted a statement attributed to Ghandi. You wanted me to read the great wisdom of the great Ghandi and here are those words, “I like your Christ. I do not like your Christians. They are so unlike your Christ”. Ghandi.

      Why would Ghandi like Jesus Christ. Jesus says to Ghandi that he as well as all men everywhere are sinners separated from God and on their way to an eternal hell. For your information Ghandi did not believe he was a sinner. He also did not believe that Jesus Christ was God who died on the cross for his personal sin. What Ghandi did do however, was to make Jesus into something Jesus never claimed to be. That is, Ghandi made Jesus into a good moral man that came to us for an example to follow. What Ghandi just did is the Hegelian Dialetic.

      Why would Ghandi not like Christians Matt? Is it because Ghandi was exposed to real evangelism where men are taught that they are sinners separated from God and on their way to hell? That Jesus Christ is the eternal God and that only through the shed blood of Jesus Christ can men be saved? That their religion is false? That there is no such thing as
      reincarnation? That there is no Nirvana? That the gods they worship are actually demons?

      By the way all of your infereces and name calling were not appreciated.

    • lamarzulli said

      Hey everyone – I think we need to drop this for a while as the posts have gotten so far from the point that it has become a distraction. The bottom line for me is this. Hate speech is hate speech and each of us is going to have to define what that is.
      Before the Civil War, some people actually believed that AFrican American were not entirely human. In Nazi Germany the Jews and others were deemed not human and were rounded up and put in campls. In my opinion Worley and other of his ilk are once again banging the same dreadful drum. I think we need to move on as more than likely no one is going to change his or her opinion at this point. Let’s drop it, please. There are other issues that in some ways are far more pressing. Peace – out! L.A.

    • mark huss said

      Mr. Marzulli:

      “Letyour speech be alway with grace, seasoned with salt, that ye may know how ye ought to answer every man” Colossians 4:6

      Mark Huss

  29. Worley didn’t understand the spirit in which he was speaking. It has happened before:

    Luke 9:54-6 And when his disciples James and John saw [this], they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven, and consume them, even as Elias did? But he turned, and rebuked them, and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of. For the Son of man is not come to destroy men’s lives, but to save [them]. And they went to another village.

    It is human nature to want to blow another human away who seems to be wrong, forgetting that we are all wrong, fallen, wretched and in need of salvation. God is perfectly capable of weeding out the good from the bad, and he will. He doesn’t need us to move the people into camps whom we think are the worst sinners.

    Worley was wrong to call for this – it nullifies everything else he said.

  30. David Blum said

    Reblogged this on Truth Junkie and commented:
    I find this article to be good I do want to say that this in no way means i condone homosexuality or the gay lifestyle whether it be between 2 men or 2 women. I do believe that God can save anyone he chooses but for the record In order to be saved we need to repent of our sins. I don’t believe nor have I read where God thinks homosexuality is ok.

  31. gerie said

    Gods word condemns homosexuality. The Pastor is not speaking death when he condemns homosexuality, but is just repeating what’s already in there. Something that many Pastors these days are afraid to do. He never once suggested that they be put to death but wished that they could be separated somehow, from influencing others. Now we the church and the general public are the ones being bullied by the homosexuals and shamed into keeping quiet. Try standing with a sign that quotes scripture while a gay pride parade is going on and see just who is bullying who. We are never to be ashamed of preaching this gospel. Now those who complain of being bullied are the ones who are forcing their agenda, every where we turn. Whether it be in text books or comic books.

    (Eph 5:5)
    5 For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.
    6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
    7 Be not ye therefore partakers with them.
    8 For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:
    9 (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth;)
    10 Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.
    11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather REPROVE them.
    12 For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.
    13 But all things that are reproved are made manifest by the light: for whatsoever doth make manifest is light.

    Your answer is in verse 11. We are to reprove the works of darkness, of which homosexuality most certainly qualifies. Also Jesus was hated because He told always told them that the things they were doing were sinful and would send them to Hell. We are supposed to walk the way that He walked, as lights in this world, reproving sin and backing Pastors who are actually doing their job and not just reading some generic sermon printed off the Internet.

    (John 7:7) Jesus said, ” The world cannot hate you; but me it hateth, because I testify of it, that the works thereof are evil.

    Yes its good to pray for them in our churches, but that alone is not good enough. We were also sent to preach the word to them.

    • No one is arguing whether God’s word condemns the practice of homosexuality. The problem is the treatment of these people for which Worley is calling. He wants to dehumanize them – put them into camps and feed them (or not) like animals. Even the most sinful human being is still made in the image of God. Every human being must be treated with dignity, and rounding them up and putting them into camps doesn’t qualify.

      You are dancing all around this, Gerie, so I’ll ask you directly. Do you believe homosexuals should be round up into camps and left to die?

    • Debra said

      My oh my Gerie… you certainly seem to be wielding that word ‘condemn’ like an executioners axe! Indeed, Jesus did say “Go and sin no more”. But He also said…in the same verse and context…”Neither do I condemn you.”
      Time for me to chime in with Rose on her closing question to you: “Do you believe homosexuals should be rounded up into camps and left to die?”

    • gerie said

      The problem that I have with this whole subject and have had from the beginning is that a majority of Pastors in America, are intimidated and are not preaching that homosexuality is a sin. Finally after we find one that will, the congregation joins with CNN to condemn him. Who in their right mind believes that he literally wants to take them and put them behind barbed wire? Especially in light of what was said on the second video? The press is always looking for someone to slip up in order to accuse them of hate speech and to make their case that gays are being discriminated against. To accuse him is to disregard what he said afterwards, and may have said that very same day (were you there? Yet you are judging him as if you were) things that you have already said you will not accept. That is very hash judgement of our brother in Christ, IMO. The worst thing in the world is when you take your gay child to church and the Pastor doesn’t back up what you have been teaching him at home. If my son were gay, I would rather for him to go to Pastor Worleys church where he was made to feel ashamned, instead of the church down the street that preaches tolerance. Tolerance doesn’t pressure him to make a decision, but will coddle him and deceive him into thinking that his sin is not so bad, until one day, unexpectly he dies in those sins. He’s never made to feel the “life and death” seriousness of his situation. Jesus never deceived people like that, but made them understand in plain english, what it would mean if they died in those sins.
      (Eph 5:11)

      11 And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather REPROVE them.

      This is what that word reprove means in the greek…

      elegchō

      ) to convict, refute, confute

      a) generally with a suggestion of shame of the person convicted

      b) by conviction to bring to the light, to expose

      2) to find fault with, correct

      a) by word

      1) to reprehend severely, chide, admonish, reprove

      2) to call to account, show one his fault, demand an explanation

      b) by deed

      1) to chasten, to punish

      You say you are worried about their dignity. When it comes to sin, dignity is out the door. If you are a practicing homosexual you lost your dignity a long time ago. What’s needed is humility. To humbly come to Jesus for forgiveness of sins. But why should they come to Jesus, when nobody makes a big deal about sin anymore? Or saying that all sin is the same. Is that true? Is all sin the same?
      (John 19:11)

      11 Jesus answered, Thou couldest have no power at all against me, except it were given thee from above: therefore he that delivered me unto thee hath the GREATER sin.

      Today sin is all lumped together and one who steals food because hes hungry is deemed the same as one who murders his mother? By whose standards? Surely not God’s. Even in the church, especially in the church sin is not rebuked, but rather excuses are made. Be careful they say, what you say to that sinner, you might hurt his feelings. Thats what he needs! His conscience is already condemning him since God has put that witness inside of him. All He needs is for us to be honest witnesses and agree with the truth that God has already revealed to him and then lead him to Jesus. But condemnation must come before repentance and after repentance then comes the promise. Everything in its proper order. We were left on Earth for a reason. We are His witnesses, to bear witness to the truth. We are all He’s got to work with. He loves them so much and needs us to warn them without being intimidated or ashamned. We need to continually admonish eachother to speak out boldly in defence of the truth. Jesus did. Throughout His lifetime He maintained a good confession, and especially in front of Pilate, He never wavered. Sin is the enemy, homosexuality is the enemy that will take them to Hell. We need to fight this deadly sin with the only thing that will work. The truth.

    • hopeful_watcher said

      Gerie, you give the pastor the benifit of the doubt that he didn’t actually condone such solutions as rounding people up. Fine. But hyperbole and rhetoric have no place in the pulpit. He should mean what he says and say what he means especially when talking about such important topics as sin and salvation and we won’t have this problem. Satan is all to happy to make a public spectacle out of this.

      All your points of speaking truth and not buckling under political correctness, I am fine with. I personally don’t like the in your face approach as I believe it makes people defensive and its counter productive. If your genuine interest is in their salvation then I would think you would want a method that isn’t counter productive. How many homosexuals have you helped by getting in their face and saying that they are disgusting, abdominal queers. Not many I bet. Trust me they are well aware that homosexuality is considered a sin without you pointing it out. I knew adultery was a sin and yet I still did it, before I was saved.

      But if an individual turns to Jesus because of the love gospel, they are more likely to self evaluate and purge that sin their lives. Grace brought me to Christ FIRST and then I repented. Repentance only comes from a sorrowful heart and you won’t get that without love for Christ.

    • hopeful_watcher said

      Btw, praying and preaching the word are tools in the evangelical toolbox to the great commission to go and make disciples of all nations. If your tactic is not making disciples of homosexuals, then I might say the in your face tactic is failing.

    • gerie said

      Hopeful,

      When Jesus sent them out, He didn’t send them out saying, God loves you. He said “Repent, for the Kingdom of God is at hand.”

      I believe that mercy and compassion have their place and that message is being preached from the majority of pulpits out there, but it doesn’t work every time and many people just go to sleep when hearing such sermons. If I could choose only one, I would choose the fear of the Lord, because when all else fails the fear of God will always keep us from sinning.

      (Jude 1:22)

      22 And of some have compassion, making a difference:
      23 And others save with fear, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh.

      You asked how many homosexuals have I helped, by my ‘in your face method’? I think only God knows that. I do know that on my blog, it has been the number one post that they keep coming back to again and again. I find that people want the straight truth. They don’t want to be smiled at and led to a false sense of security, causing them to think that their sin isn’t so bad, and that making a decision about it can wait. Many will go to Hell because we were too timid to confront them with the truth. If God allows us to talk with them there, I believe they will be extremely disappointed with us and ask us, “Why didn’t you try harder? You knew this place existed, why did you let me off so easy? If you loved me, why didn’t you fight harder for me?”
      When we have thoroughly explained the gospel to them then we must pray continually for them. But I would never let them think that I accept it and would always want them to feel a little uncomfortable around me and sense my disapproval.The worst thing that we could do to a person, is to make them feel comfortable in their sins.

      When people were around Jesus because He was so holy, many repented, but that never stopped him from directly telling them the truth. Not only to them, but whoever else was around and would listen to Him. A careful reading of the Bible teaches us that Jesus wasn’t always pleasant with everybody who took life casually and thought they had no need for repentance. He confronted them on various occassions calling them a brood of vipers and white washed tombs. Not very politically correct and I’m afraid that if you all had seen a you tube video of Jesus calling them those things and cleaning the temple and overturning the tables you would have condemned Him thinking that He was acting too “unloving”, just as you are all condemning this Pastor, without the whole story and without being there, just like CNN.

    • Matt said

      “Do you believe homosexuals should be rounded up into camps and left to die?” Gerie never really answered that question; she must be a good dancer as she really “cut a rug” around the question. I doubted if she would answer it. As it’s a “catch” all question. If she answers yes, she is a bigot, if she answers no; it conflicts with her extremely radical religious convictions and views . I can say this about the subject, this is what runs people off from Christianity, I mean really, who wants any part of this pettiness and narrowness of the mind, ideas, and views. To even suggest Christian’s would entertain the idea of rounding up anyone into camps and left to die is a slap in the face of what our Lord Jesus taught us.

  32. Gerie, I’ll pray for you that someday you’ll understand the true nature of grace, because it’s obvious that you don’t have a clue.

    • John Michael said

      We have all heard someone say that AIDS is a curse by God for homosexuals, if that was true then only Homosexuals would get it. Sin is wrong and we all do it and guilty of one guilty of all. The sin of homosexuality pales in my opinion to murder, yet our Savior who was sin less himself forgave His murderers. We must as true followers of Yeshua pray for the unrepentant and leave judgment to God. We must judge, but we cannot condemn, it is beyond our power as much as it is that we cannot save anyone. After loving God with everything we’ve got were commanded to love our neighbor. I love everyone I know and yet do not accept their choices any more than they might accept mine. I pray that we all can give as much grace and mercy as we’ve been given.

    • Debra said

      Sounds to me as though the firebrand of ‘Christian legalism’ has reared it’s burning and pointed little head here today. Wow.

  33. Nick Peluso said

    Forgot to add …. I am a 23 year veteran Police Officer and have seen people at their worst …. all crimes are sins, but in our society not all sins are crimes. Who is worse the sinner or the criminal ? Who is worthy to be walled up in a compound with the sole purpose to keep one contained until they die off ? Is the homosexual worthy of that or the Church secretary that steals a weekends love offering to feed hungry children ? What about the meth addicted mother that starves her children because she used their food money for her next fix ? Furthermore, who is worthy to make those decisions as to who gets walled up in a compound because they commit a certain type of sin ? Forgive my sarcasim here, but I do believe in righteous anger ….. I bet no one would be wanting people walled up that commit masturbation now would we ? ….Why not, is it not a form of sexual perversion, or did God in his Wisdom intend for his children to masturbate ….. where do we as Sinners have the right to pick and choose? I should have contempt for criminals because I see daily first hand what some of them are capable of ….. but I prepare my mind daily and tell my self no matter what I may think of these individuals from my carnal point of view, they are loved by God and God wants to Save them from an eternity in hell. God is in control, and we as Believer’s can submit ourselves to God’s will or we can do our own thing and just say it is God’s will. John 3:16 ” For God so loved the WORLD ……. who is the world ? According to the Pastor ….. everyone except the homosexual …… they need to find Grace and Mercy on their own, they’re not included in the world and once they are walled up they can be forgotten about ….. that’s God’s will isn’t it? After the walls are built, will the Pastor make visits to the compound and attempt to shepard the lost to Jesus? No ……. his statement was clear enough ….. wall them up, drop some food, and eventually they will die off …… Thank you sir for doing Satan’s will and logging another black mark on the entire Christian Church.

    Do I condone homosexuality ?….. No, but I surely don’t want someone who is homosexual to suffer an eternity in hell fire just because their sin was homosexuality and my sin wasn’t. Our thought process has to go beyond the staus quo and be rooted in faith that Our Heavenly Father …. The Creator of ALL Things ….. Jesus will reach those in all forms of bondage. It has to start with the believer that is patient and loving and can bring these fellow sinners to a point where they are ready to accept Jesus as their Lord and Savior. Is Jesus not capable of doing the rest ? Those that agree with the Pastor’s way of dealing with homosexuality …… be very thankful that you are not bound in the bondage of homosexuality, or some day just maybe someone will want to wall you up until you die off …… ponder this as you lay your head on your pillow at night.

  34. gerie said

    This pastor whose whole ministry is being judged on a 2 minute clip was not singling out only homosexuals but was responding to the President who had just come out in their favor. Just because you watched a clip where he was making a point that homosexuality is a plague on this country, doesn’t mean that last week or even in that very sermon, he didn’t focus his sermon on adultery or stealing or lying. Remember that you’re only seeing TWO minutes. How long does a sermon usually last? He was speaking to his own congregation. There have been many comments made on this blog that could easily be taken out of context and also end up on national news. Would you want your brothers and sisters to also condemn you? This same thing could easily happen to any one of us, since the world doesn’t understand. As Christians we should love our brother, the way Jesus commanded us to, and give him the benefit of the doubt. He was trying to illustrate that this type of relationship is unnatural and if you put them by themselves, they would die out naturally, because it is unatural for them to be together. He NEVER said to starve them or kill them. When we repeat that we are repeating a lie and are slandering our brother in Christ.

    This man loves people and is being judged wrongfully and we should be ashamned before God that we have added to our brother’s suffering.

    In part two he said this:”I love you more than you love yourselves, because I’m praying for you to be saved.You can’t go to Heaven unless you’re washed in the blood. God saves us from our sins, and not IN our sins.” He stressed that God burned Sodom and Gomorah primarily for the sin of Sodomy.

    This is a good Pastor, that preaches the old time Gospel with no fear of being politically correct.

    Please watch the followup video. The second video is on you tube and is called,”LOCAL PASTOR CALLS FOR DEATH OF QUEERS AND HOMOSEXUALS PART 2 by CATAWBAVALLEYNOH8

    We shouldn’t ever judge things the way the world does. I still say that there are many here, that if you lived when Jesus was on the Earth you wouldn’t have understood Him either. If you had seen a 2 minute video clip of Jesus with whip in hand driving out the money changers, or calling the religious leaders white washed tombs or snakes, you would have said that certainly can’t be the Son of God. God is loving, He would never treat people that way. God is kind and would never say those things.

    Don’t just judge as the world does, but with wisdom, use righteous judgement.

    • Nick Peluso said

      Words can be stumbling blocks to non believer’s especially when they are stated by High standing members in a Church setting as would be the case for the Pastor. We will agree to disagree as we cannot measure the repercussions of our actions or words. There are other ways to state what was stated if the true motive is love, compassion, and sympathy for one’s sinful condition because they have not sought Jesus as their Lord and Savior.

      How many with a homosexual condition may have been sitting in the church, plagued with guilt and torment because they realized long ago that they were different from everyone else and not accepted or acceptable. The courage that must have been required to enter a church setting in hopes that someday an answer to their problem may be found only to have the Pastor with a few harsh words cut down their hopes without a second thought of the possible repercussions.

      Again ….. all sermons are to be based on direction from the Holy Spirit.

      Seems like the excuse is constantly …. why are we being forced to accomodate homosexuality ….. to a certain extent I agree ….. same thing with abortion …. society forces these things upon us. Let’s look at who in reality is forcing these issues upon us ….. the homosexual or the politicians, news media, and high ranking members of our various forms of government. There has been a continuing break down of our legal system of laws founded on Biblical principles.

      Who is responsible for this breakdown ….. the homosexual that wants to be accepted by society, wants to be normal and fulfill their own pursuit of happiness, or the law makers that allow our legal foundations to be hacked away by immoral thought processes of immoral men and women.

      Don’t blame the women that seek abortion or the homosexual that seeks to be accepted, for they do not yet know Jesus or the reality of eternal damnation….. blame society, blame the government, and ultimately blame ourselves because we are responsible for voting immoral persons into our law making positions.

      As for the Church ….. the Church should be a reflection of Jesus’ love and should be a refuge for lost persons regardless of their sinful condition so that the lost will feel welcome and come to a place where they may choose to follow Jesus to become a child of God.

      We as a people stand up to our politicians and say enough … we will not allow legal abortion, we will not allow same sex marriage, we will not allow our Biblical foundation to be compromised any further. We remain patient and loving toward those held in the bondage of these conditions while at the same time refuse to condone the politicians and law changes that support the sinful conduct.

      The enemy is cunning, intelligent, and ruthless. I believe this Pastor had good intentions but was tricked by the enemy and used the wrong words. Nevertheless …… the damage is done.

    • gerie said

      Did you even bother to watch Part 2 video. That right there expresses the love and attention they would have received from this Pastor. Were you there for the rest of his sermon? What church have you gone to where the sermon lasted TWO minutes? If there were closet gays there, they would have felt guilty and condemned in their sins as Worley was agreeing with the Spirit of God about their condition. Then they would have been extended the love of God at the end of the sermon, before he would let them leave. Thats the way the Gospel works!

      As far as homosexuality, the reason it is so dreaded is because when you take away their shame, they are emboldened. Shame is what holds them back. They gain their strength from numbers, thats what Worley was trying to say. Those who have discernment can see the forces building strength.One only comes out when they see another doing it, then another until you have this force that is powerful and demands to be reckoned with. It will not be silent anymore. They are tired of feeling imprisoned in their shame. They want their sin to be called normal. They are trying to smother the conviction of God in their heart by hearing people call them acceptable. Adulters aren’t doing that. Homosexuals aim to take hold of laws, to rewrite textbooks, their goal is to capture every pulpit in America. They seek to silence the word of God that witnesses against them. The spirit behind homosexuality seeks to keep their victims trapped till death, denying them the only remedy which is the pure word of Truth. Once one law is passed there will be another and another as more come out, their strength can’t be held back any more but will flood this country with silence. Silence from the word of God that they hate. Oh, we’ll still have churches, but we won’t be allowed to preach the whole word of God. It will be called hate speech. This won’t bother many Pastors anyway, because they never did preach on sin anyway, especially not that sin, since they never wanted to offend anybody.

      Heaping gobs of love on top of these individuals who are already pampered and drowning in sin is not the answer. Tough love is.

      You said blame the government? Society? What? Is that how God will judge us? We are all accountable before God for our own sins. If there is any blame it rests with the church, who are not preaching the whole word of truth anymore and I fear won’t wake up until that liberty is taken away. But by then it will be too late. After that happens, if we try to help someone by sharing the gospel, we will never know if they will be offended and turn us in to the authorities. These days are coming upon us sooner than we think. Look how quick we all are to turn on one of our own. Pray for Pastor Worley.

    • Nick Peluso said

      You seem determined to take things out of context as if you need to defend the Pastor for his unbiblical choice of words ….. part 1, part 2 …… makes no difference ….. he chose to deviate from the Word of God and put his own spin on it. If he had stuck to the Word of God, there can be no dissent …… something like… Those of you that ultimately choose the life of homosexuality and reject Jesus’ free gift of salvation and remission of sins through repentence are sentenced already by your own choice to eternity in Hell Fire upon your death…… based on scripture ……. reflects tough love, but there is no human spin attached. Totally different than walling people up in a compound, dropping in some food, and then letting them die off because they can’t physically procreate….. really don’t think the Holy Spirit selected those words.

      I also said blame society and the government for breaking down our Biblical principles and foundation for our laws because we as society elect these persons into office and they collectively force these issues down our throats….. I never said we were not accountable for OUR OWN SIN .

      Furthermore, once we become children of God through Jesus …. we tend to forget where we came from …… All have sinned and fall short of the Glory of God, there is non righteous, not one ….. which basically reminds me that now that my eyes are opened …. I need to stay focused on Jesus but not to forget that I was once lost with ignorant closed eyes and have to reach out to those that are not under Grace and whose eyes are not opened yet. If not then I become judgemental and accusatory and become a stumbling block to those that are not saved……not my right or my place to do so.

      Jesus did at times demonstrate tough love ….. He is the Savior and has that right …… Who among us has earned that same right.

      As far as the Church not preaching the Word of God ….. I agree there are some issues that need to be corrected. That is why if Pastor’s stuck to preparing their sermons through prayer and direction by the Holy Spirit, we wouldn’t have issues arise such as the incident in North Carolina. Churches have never had a problem with preaching about sin. Churches have always had problems with persons preaching what they want to preach the way they want to preach it without the direction of the Holy Spirit and then being very selective about which sins they want to preach about.

      “Heaping gobs of love on top of these individuals who are already pampered and drowning in sin is not the answer. Tough love is.” (gerie)

      My response is that Jesus heaped gobs of love on an entire world that was already pampered and drowning in sin but his way of doing it was with a wooden cross and three nails ……. the Pastor’s way is to insult the sinner with unbiblical words ….. his words, that he and he alone chose in a judgmental, accusatory, and malicious way ….. doesn’t matter if he tried to soften it up after the fact …… the damage was already done.

      Bottom line …. there wouldn’t be an issue if he had used different words.

      “Today sin is all lumped together and one who steals food because hes hungry is deemed the same as one who murders his mother? By whose standards? Surely not God’s.” (Gerie)

      Stealing food because you’re hungry implies that you have reached a point where you are so hungry you are willing to steal in order to satisfy your God given instinct of survival. Where is the criminal intent ? Murder is the taking of another’s life by means perpetrated through malice aforethought with contempt and extreme prejudice for the murdered victim” One is a crime, one is not …… let’s just say stealing and murder …… by our standards, one is higher than the other ….. by God’s standards ………….. sin is sin is sin. If not one could argue …..as long as I don’t commit sins in column B and only commit sins in column A …… I don’t have to worry about eternal damnation, because God can live with my sins in column A. Sounds almost like an old Catholic Doctrine from my youth regarding mortal sins and menial sins.

      1 Corinthians 6:9-10: “
      9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

      10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.”

      Which one is greater ? furthermore, which one is greater than homosexuality ?

      “These days are coming upon us sooner than we think. Look how quick we all are to turn on one of our own. Pray for Pastor Worley.” (Gerie)

      I agree whole heartedly with everything said here but I disagree with your reference to “One of our own”
      People are People …. the only difference is that one may be under Grace through the Blood of Jesus Christ and one may not be …… by their own free will of course.

    • gerie said

      Nick,

      It’s important to watch the second video, because it is there that he explains himself. Do you remember in the Gospels, how they were always watching Jesus, just waiting for Him to misspeak so they could accuse Him? Jesus was extremely careful with His words. But we are imperfect vessels. Even Pastors are not perfect. If Jesus waited for us all to be perfect, none of us would be used. So Worley misspoke. I agree. Who of us hasn’t and if you were a Pastor can you say for sure that you would never misspeak for five or ten years worth of sermons? How about twenty or thirty? Fourty or fifty? We are all so sure and smug, that we could do a better job than he did. How about let God be the judge of that? He was trying to demonstrate how serious this sin is and that they gain strength in numbers, which is absolutely true. He thought, how do we prevent that? And that was the answer he came up with. Of course he would never act upon it, but the greedy press seized on it. They thrive on something like this and will try to use it somehow for Obama’s benefit.
      We need to protect our children because once this sin gets a hold of a person, it is very hard to get free. Yes there are homosexuals that have been saved, but few. Thats why prevention is important, and we shouldn’t want our children to ever think this is acceptable behavior, so that they would never have the nerve to experiment with it, because like drugs, its hard to get free. People have committed adultery and somehow its different than someone who has been caught by the homosexuality demon.

      Remember one thing. The God we love, the God we all serve, didn’t just round them up, but incinerated them. He burned the whole city out! (Sodom and Gomorrah and also some of the surrounding towns). No one wants to preach on the horrors of Sodom and Gomorahh, yet this very message may be the one that finally sets them free. However, that kind of God doesn’t quite jive with the new gay love that is spreading amongst our churches and they don’t want to talk about it in this bold new age of gay love, where everybody is unashamedly, “coming out”. Everybody wants to defend and protect them, even the church. But who is protecting us from them? I don’t know about you, but I don’t like going to Barnes and Nobles and running into two men holding hands and kissing. It vexes my spirit, as Peter says. Where do Mothers hide their children? Have you noticed the gay pride parades and how they are growing year by year, becoming more and more obnoxious and vulgar? And how do you explain christians marching along with them, with signs boldly proclaiming God’s love for gays? Is that Gods will? Aren’t these also misspeaking? They are giving these people a false sense of security. God loves them, but He will still send them to Hell, love or not, if they die in their sins without repenting. How are Mothers supposed to protect their children from the gay agenda now built into the schools text books? Why is that acceptable to us? God detests their behavior as Pastor Worley rightly said. He preaches the Gospel and explains that no sin is too horrible for the blood of Jesus. The worst thing a Pastor could do is to withhold the truth. But this Pastor has very generously preached the full word of God. It is all of our job to be a witness of the truth and warn them, warn them, warn them. Its a matter of life and death. Not comfort.

      People tried to burn his church down. Is this how they silence us? Is this what the last days will look like? Many people didn’t stand with Paul when he was imprisoned. God saw then and he sees now. Those around him have been forced to carry guns. Does he have a wife or children or grandchildren? Who is bullying who? Who are violent ones? Pastor Worley or them? He didn’t mean he would act on it, but they mean every hateful threat.They are signing petitions against him to force him to resign. They are looking for criminal violations they could charge him with. They are digging up past history, and searching for unhappy parishoners to bring a charge against him. Is that right? They are hunting for blood. Do they have the support of the church? Are we also adding to his suffering?The devil is the accuser of the brethren. Lets not join in the charge. Pray for Pastor Worley

    • Nick Peluso said

      Sodom and Gomorrah ….. one element of the story that everyone seems to leave out ….. Abraham demonstrated compassion for a corrupt city and made supplication to the Lord that if ten righteous persons were found within the city that the city would not be destroyed …… ultimately the entire city chose themselves to be destroyed because there wasn’t any righteousness to be found and they chose not to repent of their sins.

      It seems to me that this is an important part of the story and also occurred during a time period where Our Savior had not yet come in human form… Our GOD that took on human form and defeated sin through his perfect sacrifice who is the sole Mediator between God and men that extends mercy and forgiveness.

      Abraham demonstrated this from a humanly point of view …. he did not want the righteous destroyed with the wicked provided that there were sinners within the city that were willing to come to repentance.

      Are we better than that ?….. those of us that can claim the precious Blood of Jesus that washes away the sin of the World.

      You are correct Pastor Worley misspoke ….. why …. because he deviated from Scripture with his own words. I sympathize with his position, because now he has opened the door for public and possibly Devine chastisement.

      None of us are above or beyond similar consequences based on our words or actions.

      I don’t condemn the scriptural message that homosexuality is a sin, but I do have issues with persons anointed to minister to the flock and are responsible for getting the unsaved into their area of ministry so that they can come to Biblical knowledge of who Jesus is and that there is no sin too great that the Lord cannot rescue them from it or rescue them from eternal damnation.

      I will pray for Pastor Worley ….. I will pray that he will not be subjected to vigil anti type acts of violence.

      I believe that he became emotionally wound up in the political influences of our society that condone same sex marriage, abortion, gay rights etc….and he went about the whole affair from a human secular point of view rather than a Spirit filled Godly direction. It happens sometimes that way, but I think it is clear that when we use our own thought processes and deviate from the path that God intends ….. we may suffer consequences. I think most of us have suffered consequences for doing exactly the same thing, I know I have.

      We cannot make the gay community come to Church, we can however extend to them the same brotherly and sisterly love that we extend to all sinners and hope that they will want what we have. Ultimately the choice is theirs as is with all sinners that may end with the unforgiveable sin that is the total rejection of Our Lord and Savior Jesus with the end result of dying in sin.

      I will not subscribe to thinking that the harsh way of dealing with sin during the Old Testament days is the current status quo now that the Savior has come, defeated sin, and wants to save the world from eternal damnation. That was not possible before Jesus because no one could keep the law …. the entire reason for Jesus dying on the cross. God could not look upon sin, but Jesus became sin …. the sin of the world, defeated Satan and sin, and washed that sin away……new ball game. We can have that relationship with our heavenly Father through Jesus because through him we are white as snow and unblemished. Does that mean we totally discount the testimony of the Old Testament ? Absolutely not !!! We need to study and observe the lessons contained within those volumes of text, apply those lessons to our lives where applicable, and remember that there is a new covenant through Jesus that empowers the believer to minister to the unbeliever no matter what type of bondage they may be captive of.

      We cannot single out any one sin and condemn those that are part of it …. we can accept the sinner without accepting their sin. If I condemn them, I condemn myself and the love of God is not in me.

      Attack the problem through prayer and fellowship ….. getting the message across the correct way, the Spirit filled way, the Godly way…. the way that makes the ungodly want what God has to offer through Jesus.

      Greater is He that is in me than is in the world ….. I don’t worry about us being protected from ” them “. If they invade my little corner of the world or my family then I will put on my armor, draw my sword, and do battle the spiritual way. God does not need my help to do miracles ….. he does demand that I prepare myself for spiritual warfare through his Word and prayer. In the meantime I will not support those that are in power who fulfill their own agenda in backing unrighteous, unbiblical, and immoral behavior in our society. This has to be dealt with continuously from our pulpits but confined to a scriptural context only without the personal thoughts of men….. Hebrews 4:12 The word of God is living and powerful, and sharper than any two-edged sword, piercing even to the division of soul and spirit, and of joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart. Who can possibly put their own spin on this verse of scripture and possibly out do the power contained in the Word of God? If the sin message of homosexuality is confined to this context ….. there is no room for rebuttal and furthermore God’s Word does not return to him void or empty. No need to add judgmental comments …. the scripture convicts all by itself.

      We both are headed towards the same finish line, we just have different routes in getting there. We live in a different generation where there is major dissention for authority whether it be Godly authority, parental authority, or Governmental authority …… The old tactic of tough love and scaring the …… out of people works sometimes, and then again sometimes it doesn’t ….. we have to be mentally smarter than the enemy and try new tactics, after all souls are at stake here. As the old saying goes you attract more fly’s with honey than you do vinegar.

      I do not subscribe to a witch hunt of pastor Worley …… he made a very big mistake with his secular world view words ….. he should be accountable, but not at the hands of vigilantism, or our legal system as he had no criminal intent, which is required with all crimes as an element of the crime. He should however be subjected to accountability to his own congregation and required to repent of his statements that were not taken from scripture. Satan is the accuser of the unblemished Brethren washed in the Blood of Jesus….. the Brethren are charged with rebuking one another for unrighteous conduct contrary to what is contained in the scriptures.

    • gerie said

      I agree with much of what you have said, but not all. Is the old Testament irrelevant since grace came? I’m not saying that you said that, but is it? Then why did the early church constantly bring up Sodom and Gomorrah using those stories to instill fear in those who were saved by grace? Even Lord Jesus Himself mentioned it more than once. They were reminded of Sodom & G often. God wanted the horrors of it’s punishment to be so burned in our memories so that we wouldn’t sin after the same manner as they did. Read verse 6. Does our generation fit in there?

      Peter preached it!

      (2 Peter 2:4) For if God spared not the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment…
      6 And turning the cities of Sodom and Gomorrah into ashes condemned them with an overthrow, *making them an ensample unto those that after should live ungodly;*
      7 And delivered just Lot, vexed with the filthy conversation of the wicked:
      8 (For that righteous man dwelling among them, in seeing and hearing, vexed his righteous soul from day to day with their unlawful deeds;)
      Jude preached it!

      (Jude1:7) Even as Sodom and Gomorrah, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance of eternal fire.

      They both brought up that what happened to them, was an EXAMPLE of the same type of punishment in store for those in the future, who would dare to sin in the same way as these people did. Paul also wrote about the stories in old testament often and God’s judgement on them, using their punishment as teaching tools, so that they would understand God’s ways, better. Its the same God! Jesus warned us all to FEAR HIM! Thats why there is so much sin in the church today. When the Apostles wrote them letters, it was about grace yes, but fear was present too. Always in every letter there were warnings for them to stay in grace and to hold on to what they had been given. But today, we have the fear of men, and we are afraid to go there. We please men and ourselves and not God. We preach a soft Gospel, a comfortable Gospel.This whole way of thinking is being inspired by Hell. But Christians who are being led by the Spirit of God WILL go there. We won’t withhold what God wants them to know. We WILL use the fear of God to save them. God wants us to. He tells us to save some using fear. If some don’t need it fine, but lets not neglect the rest that DO need it in order to be saved.

      (Jude 1:23)
      And others save with FEAR, pulling them out of the fire; hating even the garment spotted by the flesh

      (1 Peter 1:17)

      And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man’s work, pass the time of your sojourning here in FEAR:

      ( Phil 2:12)

      Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with FEAR and trembling.

      God meant for us to use all of these Old T stories to instill fear in the hearts of sinners. Everything isn’t always all about grace. Grace is important, but judgement and justice are involved and we are warned over and over (v 15) that we can fall from grace. But the *fear of God*, will keep us IN that grace.

      (Heb 12:15) Looking diligently lest any man *fail of the grace of God*; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled

      16 Lest there be any fornicator, or profane person, as Esau, who for one morsel of meat sold his birthright.
      17 For ye know how that afterward, when he would have inherited the blessing, he was rejected: for he found no place of repentance, though he sought it carefully with tears.

      Is anyone preaching that even after we are saved, our hearts can be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin and that there is a chance that we might not make it? Will Christ have to be crucified a second time for us because we went back into the world and indulged our flesh again?

      ( 2 Peter 2:20)

      20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
      21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.

      (Heb 10:28)

      28 He that despised Moses’ law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
      29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
      30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
      31 It is a FEARFUL thing to fall into the hands of the living God.

      There they go again. There goes Peter and Paul, digging around in the OT bringing up Moses now, in order to instill FEAR in their people. Why aren’t we doing the same? The fear of God is not being preached and the blood of many is on our hands because of focusing exclusively on grace. Think of the homosexual boys who have committed suicide because they couldn’t bear the shame. The world blames us and that “evil” Bible. However, it can’t be us because we are preaching grace. It is coming from the same demonic spirit that causes them to be gay in the first place. But if we would do our job and preach on Hell again, like we are supposed to, these boys would know that once they died, a greater torment is waiting for them, much more terrible than the mere shame they were experiencing. Jesus warned them about Hell. Thats what we should be doing. The Gospel is about so much more than grace. We are giving Gods grace away like candy. Repentence must come first. And then to stay in that grace, obedience must follow. We are doing irrepairable damage with this “Gospel of Nice.” Is everybody who is on God’s side nice? What about these two witnesses in Rev?

      (Rev)4 These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the God of the earth.
      5 And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.
      6 These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have power over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.

      Aren’t they doing what God did in the OT? Smiting the Earth with plagues? Its the OT all over again. Is that very nice? The people on Earth will think that our God is not very nice to do these things to the poor innocent people. Why does He do it then? Because of SIN. Sin is the enemy, not Pastor Worley or others that preach the truth. The sin of homosexuality is an evil sin that God particularly hates. Yes there are many sins and transgressions, but homosexuality caused God to come down and destroy a whole nation. This story is in there to be preached on. Its in there to be remembered, not ignored. I realize that if you are sold out to this Gospel of Nice, you haven’t heard or taken seriously a word I have said. God bless you.

    • Nick Peluso said

      Again ” Does that mean we totally discount the testimony of the Old Testament ? Absolutely not !!! We need to study and observe the lessons contained within those volumes of text, apply those lessons to our lives where applicable, and remember that there is a new covenant through Jesus that empowers the believer to minister to the unbeliever no matter what type of bondage they may be captive of. ” No need to add to this, my statement was clear enough.

      You continue to try and justify the singling out of the homosexual community, which goes back to the Pastors statement that reflected his judgment, not God’s judgment. Neither you or the Pastor are divinity …. you do not know who may be saved and who may not be saved in the gay community. If they happen to come to your spiritual side of the fence you do not reach out with compassion and love, instead you reach out with judgment and contempt and say that it is tough love and solely motivated by love. …… yup, bet the gay community that wants to come to know Jesus are beating down your church doors to get a seat in the front row because they know how much you love them if the Pastor’s statements are a reflection of this so called tough love.

      I really don’t know what your point is anymore ….. if you and the pastor want to collectively include all sinners, I’m right there with you with the same message ….. get right or get left …… get saved or spend an eternity separated from God in hell fire ….. ultimately the choice is up to the individual.

      David was an adulterer and Murderer ….. Saul of Tarsus persecuted and murdered Christians before becoming the Apostle Paul …. and yet they both had to some extent a one on one relationship with God that brought both of them through Grace and mercy to be used by God once they repented of their sin.

      Time is not relevant to God because He is outside our time and space dimension. God knows beforehand who will come to repentance and seek the Lord and who will not …. He knew everyone before they were born ….. Seeing God knows these things and we do not, how are we to conduct ourselves as far as trying to bring the lost to Jesus ? We do not know who will come to be saved therefore we approach all sinners the same way, in the same manner, without being judgmental and singling people out because of their sin condition. As long as they are willing to some extent to submit to God’s will we remain patient, loving, and unbiased. The sinner will ultimately choose Jesus or reject Jesus …. very simple concept. If they reject Jesus … then maybe that opens the door for a one on one tough love pitch. Singling out entire classes of people and being judgmental, accusatory, and representing Jesus’ Church with inflammatory statements based on the thoughts of men should not be tolerated.

      If you or the Pastor were sinless or became sinless following your Born again position rooted in Jesus, then maybe you would have the right to single out certain classes of Sinners. None of us our sinless and therefore none of us have the right to point out the speck in the sinners eye under bias for a certain sinful condition when most of us have planks in our own eyes.

      When I stand before the Lord …. I will be shown all of my blown opportunities where I could have led someone to the Lord. If the Lord asks me what did I do to bring the lost sinner to meet him so that they might be saved …. at this very moment I will be able to say that I did not persecute the homosexual and suggest isolating them in an electrified fence until they all died off because they could not procreate.

      That is what this whole conversation has been about and the issue keeps coming up that that the Pastor according to scripture has a right to single this particular class of sinner out while he himself is still a sinner ….. do you not see the hypocrisy in that ?

      Let’s go back to Sodom and Gomorrah …. is there a hidden message in there? We assume that the two city’s were filled with just sexual perversion because it was so prevalent in the story. This was not a surprise to Abraham as Lot lived in the city with his family. Abraham asks God not once, but several times to not destroy the cities if there may be righteous persons in the cities. Abraham starts with fifty righteous and keeps subtracting from that number until he gets to ten righteous in the cities. Does God get angry with Abraham for continuing to ask ? No …. God’s answer is he will not destroy the cities provided there are the specified number of righteous persons each time God is asked.

      If God was so set on destroying the Cities because of all the wickedness, why did God not get angry with Abraham, tell Abraham to shut up because as far as God was concerned, the Cities were already predetermined to be toast ? Why did Abraham even care about the Cities filled with wickedness and sexual perversion other than his own family ? Furthermore, Why was Abraham even chosen by God ? Could it be that Abraham, created in the image of God, may have possessed some Godly qualities such as a big heart and compassion for mankind ? Could it be that God, all Holy and Powerful, that cannot look upon sin needed an excuse not to destroy the cities ? Could it be that Abraham with his big heart was the only vessel that could provide God with an excuse not to the destroy the Cities because Abraham was a sinner that could look upon sin, was in an already predetermined sinful condition that originated at the Garden of Eden, and Abraham, because of his compassion, could only be the one to ask God for mercy thereby giving God an excuse to not destroy the Cities ?

      I submit to you that God wanted a reason to not destroy the cities and that is why every time Abraham asked and reduced the number of righteous God did not become angry and said yes He would not destroy the cities.

      Now if what I just stated is possibly the reality of the story that would mean that in order for there to be righteous persons there would have to be sinners that would take heed to the warning of destruction and be willing to repent and have their sin cleansed through an animal sacrifice ceremony that would ultimately take place at some future date. At that particular moment they were sinners in a wicked city performing all kinds of sexual perversion including other unmentioned sins that I’m sure all of us have committed.

      That scenario includes the homosexual that the story uses as the prevalent example of sexual perversion. God already knew that there were none righteous, or none willing to come out and repent of their sin. Abraham didn’t know this but God allowed Abraham to ask for mercy on their behalf each and every time anyway ….. why ? Was God trying to make Abraham look foolish in hindsight when it was all said and done ?

      Could it be that God had to demonstrate to Abraham that Abraham’s compassion was a reflection of God’s compassion ? God wanted Abraham to know that God loved mankind even in their most horrendous sinful state and wanted to save them.

      The rest of the story is history and we know that they refused to repent, died in their sins, and their cities were destroyed by God as an example of God’s judgment for those that reject God’s love and mercy.

      Seems to me that this story also demonstrates Jesus’ love and compassion and reflects exactly what Jesus did, what He came to do, and how he came to do it.

      Does Jesus not go to God when we are accused by Satan to be the mediator between us and God …. Did Jesus not walk among mankind and look upon a sinful world prior to His crucifixion ? Did he not demonstrate his compassion for all sinners ?

      We see here Abraham and Jesus trading places, except this time Jesus is God in the flesh and can look upon sin because he is manifest in the human condition. He does not allow Himself to be defiled by sin but does become the sin of the world at His death thereby becoming a perfect sinless sacrifice that defeats the power of sin through His Blood that washes all the sin of the world away ….. past, future, present.

      So now we have two sides of the coin ….. Grace and mercy / judgment and eternal damnation….BTW in that order.

      Who among us are worthy to strip away the compassion of God / Abraham / or The Savior of the entire world ?

      Who is worthy to pick and choose who we have compassion for and who we do not ?

      Tough love or Gospel of Nice ?

      Seems to me Gospel of nice is prevalent in this story if we really look at what God did. The ending to the story was bad and culminated with Judgment, but by whos choice ? Not God’s. Sodom and Gomorrah made their own choice and suffered the consequences.

    • Nick Peluso said

      Let’s also go back to this verse of scripture that outlines persons who are not saved, refuse to repent, and remain in a state determined to continue to commit these sins and will not inherit the Kingdom of God …..

      1 Corinthians 6:9-10: “
      9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,

      10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.”

      ” nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind ” refers to the homosexual and bisexual sin condition.

      If there was a rank structure to these sins implied from the verses, the list would look like this:

      1. fornicators ……. exempt from being walled up
      2. idolaters ….. exempt from being walled up
      3. adulterers …..exempt from being walled up
      4. effeminate, abusers of themselves with man kind ( homo and bi-sexuals ) ….. walled up until they die off according to Pastor Worley
      5. thieves …. prison
      6. covetous …. exempt from being walled up
      7. drunkards ……. hospital if they are alcoholics / prison for the crime
      8. revilers …. exempt from being walled up
      9. extortioners …… prison

      Well, If all sin is not equal in terms of eternal damnation, then according to the list fornicators, idolaters, and adulterers come before the homosexual crowd …… oh my ….. didn’t see that one coming …… we may have to rethink this because the homosexual crowd can come into probably any church in America and suggest that all of the fornicators and adulterers are an abomination to the Lord before they are and all fornicators and adulterers need to be walled up, drop some food, and keep them separate so that they will die off eventually. They probably could expect 10 to 15 percent of the church population depending on the size of the church to be guilty of living in these types of sin. Of course there wouldn’t be any persons committing these types of sins in Pastor Worley’s church now would there, so he’ll stick to his plan that he could not get passed through Congress as his solution and continue to single out homosexuals.

      Too harsh you say …. you forget, I am a Police Officer and see people at their worst, especially ” Christians “.

      Ya know the more I think about this issue the more disgusted I get.

      Here’s something to ponder …. since time is not relevant to God and all scripture is given by inspiration of God …. could it be that God intentionally had the scriptures penned in the New Testament in a fashion to put homo and bi-sexuality after fornication and adultery so that tough love christians would not be able to justify singling out the homosexual ? Naaaw …… God wouldn’t do that would He ….. We don’t have any saved christians or lost persons fornicating or committing adultery …. we have to have christians that are better than the lost and other christians don’t we … after all it’s the mission of us christians that once Jesus extends his mercy and grace towards us and saves us, we then need to go into the world and be judgmental, accusatory, and malicious towards certain types of sinners. Let’s all rejoice that we may have been responsible for causing someone to die in their sins because of our hate speech ….. backed by good intentions of course.

      Tough Love Crowd folks …Stop forgetting where you came from and the sinful condition Jesus delivered you from and start looking at all sin. Stop singling classes of sin conditions out as being worse than others and start ministering to the lost out of compassion and love and let Jesus do the rest. The lost need your love, not your hate speech because in reality that is exactly what it is. You just call it by another name…. tough love. The same tough love that allowed some Bible belt christians from the beginning of our country all through the civil rights movement of the 60’s to lynch, terrorize, and bomb churches and stated that the Bible taught segregation and their tough love methods and tactics were justified.

      BTW …. Pastor Worley’s speech is protected in the pulpit, but if he had used that same wording in public, it would be considered in my jurisdiction a crime under common law ….. a law that dates back to the 1700’s and originated in England and is still the law today extended down from the original thirteen colonies. Case law has put more focus on the type of speech that is covered under the ” Fighting Words Doctrine ” which basically says that any speech that would incite one to violence or insult one to the point that they immediately become violent toward the one making the hateful words is guilty of Breach of Peace or in some jurisdictions statutory Disorderly Conduct. Obviously That was not Worley’s intentions, but his words are his words and it is what it is …. hate speech.

      It’s time to wake-up people …. time is short …. we are in the last days, and our Redeemer is returning soon !!!!!

    • Elaine said

      Best response yet…..THANK YOU NICK!!!!

    • Nick Peluso said

      “Pastor Worley has been attacked by the Brethren ……. Satan is delighting in the fact that Pastor Worley is being attacked by the Brethren ….. The Brethren will be judged for attacking Pastor Worley……”

      Let me put this in a different scenario:

      1. A child is brutally abused by a pedophile

      2. The prosecution has to prove guilt beyond a reasonable doubt in a trial setting

      3. The prosecution has one chance only to prove guilt and get Justice served on behalf of the abused Victim

      4. The pedophile’s rights have to be observed throughout the entire process from arrest to trial

      5. The prosecution cannot do anything to prejudice the public or potential jurors

      6. The arresting Officer is part of the prosecution

      7. I happen to be the arresting Officer and am very familiar with the entire Judicial process

      8. I am not allowed to bring up any past criminal conduct regarding the pedophile because every offense has to stand alone by law

      9. I make a good arrest and follow the process

      10. the incident draws media attention and I give the facts of the case to the media

      11. I am supposed to enforce the law unbiasedly and without prejudice.

      12. My personal view is that I have extreme contempt for pedophiles

      13. At the press conference I give the facts of the case but make my personal views known ….. call the pedophile a “scumbag ” on tv and go on to tell the whole world what a criminal this pedophile is and give them a rundown of every criminal offense the pedophile had been arrested for.

      14. My actions cause the public and local potential jurors to be prejudicial towards the pedophile and as a result the defense has the case thrown out and makes the argument that I singled the pedophile out without evidence. Framed the pedophile based on my own personal prejudicial statements, and unlawfully released information regarding the pedophile’s past criminal record prior to trial resulting in a lawsuit against my agency and me.

      What are the repercussions because of my actions and statements that deviated from the facts of the case and represented my contempt for the pedophile charged with the crime ?

      1. Justice was not served on behalf of the victim because the case was thrown out
      2. I deviated from my sworn duty to be unbiased and unprejudicial in the performance of my duties.
      3. my agency and I suffer criticism and public outcry from the public and the family of the victim
      4. My actions cause distrust of Police Officers in my community
      5. My agency is sued and tax dollars are paid to the pedophile in damages
      6. I am no longer considered an asset to my agency and expose myself to disciplinary action from my superiors.
      7. My Brother and Sister Officers suffer from the embarrassment caused by my unprofessional actions
      8. My work associates no longer want me to be involved in any of their criminal investigations
      9. My attitude worsens and finally results in termination from my employment and the end of my career.
      10. I blame the pedophile for all that has occurred and the end of my career.

      Who is to blame for the repercussions? Who is responsible to correct my conduct that deviated from the legal process ? Those that are required to take action for my conduct will be subject to similar action for doing what they are supposed to do ? That makes no sense.
      After all of the repercussions caused by my actions …… would it really matter to the public that prior to my unprofessional conduct I had an unblemished record as an Officer of the law for an extended period of time ? Some fellow Officers would be sympathetic, but not the public.

      Well, that scenario is not biblical you say …… neither were Pastor Worleys statements as to his solution for the homosexual community.
      Furthermore, in his statement when he said he couldn’t get his idea passed through Congress ….. did he really go before Congress with such a solution ? I think not, which means he was making a joke in the middle of his statement ……Yup, lets joke about it too, that’s appropriate and definitely represents that true love for the homosexual doesn’t it ? …. But hey it got a laugh and ultimately an ovation from the congregation though didn’t it. Don’t place the blame on Pastor Worley …. place it on the homosexual, place it on the Brethren that were shocked that a Man of God would make such statements towards fellow sinners in the pulpit setting and were not happy with Pastor Worley’s self chosen personal solution for the gay community. He made the statements …. he did not mean them literally …… no one cares that he did not mean them literally. The damage was done and more fallout from the situation is still pending. We as a church will also suffer repercussions. Let’s exercise that tough love towards the sinner but using tough love towards a Pastor is forbidden.

      Pastor Worley is being attacked by the public for his actions …… Pastor Worley is subject to correction by the organization that he represents. Christians will not be judged for bringing to light the unbiblical statements made by the Pastor and demanding that the issue be dealt with according to Biblical principles. Satan is delighting in the fact that Pastor Worley chose his own words and deviated from the Word of God that caused the division in the church and public outcry. The lost homosexual has more ammunition to justify their sinful condition because, in their unopened eyes, Pastor Worley is a Hypocrite and a hate monger.

    • gerie said

      NICK YOU SAID THIS: You continue to try and justify the singling out of the homosexual community…

      Why are you choosing to believe with others here, that Worley ONLY preaches against homosexuality and no other sins? You get all that from a 2 minute clip? Did you over look the part where he also called Obama a baby killer, referencing abortions? Do you think that maybe, even that very day, he might have gone into an elaborate talk on the sinfulness of killing babies? Were you there? God was. Have you sat in his church for a few weeks in order to make that accusing judgement against him that he only focuses on the sin of homosexuality? Can you prove it ? You sound like a spokes person for that same community who are always complaining of that very thing. They don’t have to do any thing, you are doing their job for them and getting the word out that they only are singled out. In all good conscience can you really come to that final conclusion from a mere two minutes taken out of, probably an hour long sermon? He was responding to Obama’s recent decision to come out in favor of gay marriage! It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to see that. He was acknowledging current events that will be devastating to our country. So stop saying that he only preaches against one sin and not others. He was doing his job and preaching against sin. Period. Isn’t that his job? And he was doing it the best he could. To his own Master he stands or falls. If we held all Pastors up to your standards, how many would fall short. Thankfully God doesn’t judge things according to what seems right to men, but judges righteous judgement. Always. The man was preaching the seriousness of sin and its devastating effects on a society. What would you say Gods biggest concern is with? Sin, or people’s feelings? You all don’t seem to understand the seriousness of sin. SIN! Its DEADLY! You fail to understand that these people are carrying around a TIME BOMB and it’s just a matter of time till death ignites it and plunges them straight into Hell! All the love and good will in the world won’t get that deadly sin out of them. You can do good deeds towards them for the rest of their lives and those good deeds will NEVER touch their sin. But the preaching of Gods word will! It will give them knowledge that will make them understand whats actually going on inside of them. The evil thats destroying them from the inside out, but remains hidden from their view.

      Tell me, have we all been commissioned to go into the world with the “love gospel”? Jesus didn’t send them out to preach the love of God, He sent them out and commanded them to REPENT! There is NO other way to be saved. We think that we can save people by being loving and kind. There are millions of people in the world that are very loving and kind and protective of the gay community, especially Hollywood and the democratic party. What more are you doing than them? They seem loving and kind and you also seem loving and kind. And they might even be MORE loving and MORE tolerant than you are. Then what? What if they have more time or money to express their love, then you do? The power is *in the Gospel*. Never forget that. The power is in true repentance. Why does our country look the way it does? Because of SIN! Because the morals have eroded. Why? Because we are preaching this Gospel *our own way* and handing out the free gift of grace like candy to all who meet *our* requirements. Not God’s. He STILL requires repentance and a complete change of lifestyle, from the heart.

      The coldness of Christians astounds me. In some instances the love for the world and Gods enemies, exceeeds our love for eachother. King Jehoshaphat almost died for coming to the aide of God’s enemy. He was deceived. So are many of us even though we say, we see.

      (2 Chron 19:2) And Jehu the son of Hanani the seer went out to meet him, and said to king Jehoshaphat, **Shouldest thou help the ungodly, and love them that hate the LORD?** therefore is wrath upon thee from before the LORD

      Everything you say sounds very good and pleases men, but not God, who requires loyalty. Especially for our own. And Pastor Worley IS one of our own, if you yourself are part of the body of Christ. Think of the damage, we are doing to his congregation. They were there and heard the WHOLE sermon and his congregation is standing with him. But what will it do to their faith when they see that we abandon him in his time of need and turn our backs and leave him, to be devoured by hungry wolves. Many also left Paul, when he came under persecution. Its easy for us to look right and loving and win the favor of men. But that won’t help us at the judgement seat of Christ, where we will all be held accountable and responsible for how well we kept His commandments and how we treated our brothers and sisters in Christ. Jesus said a new commandment I give you, to love one another as I have loved you. God takes our love for eachother so seriously that a christan can even be denied entrance into Heaven if they die while holding unforgiveness towards their brother or sister in Christ. God cares much more about how we treat eachother, than how we have treated the world. Or if we have preferred those in the world, or have come to sinner’s aide, over our brother.

      I don’t believe we should go out of our way to make friends with drug addicts, or alcoholics or homosexuals and bring them into our homes which impresses young children who are influenced by their behavior, lest one day they grow up and announce to you that they are also gay, or become drug addicts or alcoholics. God doesn’t need us hanging around them to save them. When God moves them to repentance they will seek us out. He is perfectly capable of convicting their heart and sending them to you when they are ready to be saved. I was saved all alone with the Holy Spirit and a sheet of paper with some scriptures on it. I would never put me and my family in jeopardy and unnecessarily expose them to sin. Sin is deadly, remember? Stop thinking that it doesn’t effect you because it does. It affects us all. We are always being influenced everyday, for good or evil. The Bible says that the wise man sees the danger and hides himself, but the fool passes on and is punished. Remember to pray, please for Pastor Worley in your prayers today, and for his congregation who are also suffering, whose faith may have been shaken over the way they have been abandoned by the church. God bless, everybody.

    • Elaine said

      Uh,oh…..I have to repent of not condemning sin long and loud wherever I find it!!!!! That does it….next time my son takes the family to the kids favorite buffet restaurant I am going to stand up and start preaching loudly on the sin of gluttony at all who I see going back for seconds or having dessert when their butt is bigger than I think it should be! Then I am going to call out to my son and his wife and tell them, “Quick, get the children away from these sinners!” and as management drags me out the door I will be screaming “REPENT, REPENT YOU ABOMINABLE SINNERS!!!”
      I won’t have to suggest anyone be fenced in since they will already be in the Golden Corral!

    • Ha! I’d love to see that. I’d pay good money to see that!

    • gerie said

      Elaine, When I sense the Lord is leading me to write a comment, when I involve myself with God’s holy things, I take it all very seriously. I know that you don’t know me, but can I tell you that I agonize over every single word I write. I don’t take these things lightly. I have always taken my salvation extremely seriously, knowing that I’ll be judged for every word. That is what the word of God teaches us, and thats also why the Bible warns us that foolish talking and jesting are not convenient.

      (Eph 5:3) But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints; Neither filthiness, nor *foolish talking, nor jesting,* which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.

      And even though my flesh might like to take advantage of a situation, I allow the Spirit of God to lead me, and I hold my peace, because I have learned through the years, by sitting at His feet, that the Lord loves a meek and quiet spirit. To Him these things, for whatever His reason, are the most valuable.

      I know you don’t mean any harm and maybe you’re uncomfortable with the serious tone of these things, but I have to say that honestly, I don’t think anything being said here is funny at all. Every single word has been heart felt, and for no other reason then to defend my brother Pastor Worley, because when he hurts I hurt, since we are part of the same body, and also in what ever way I can, to shine light on the truth. That’s all. I bless you Elaine, with all of the good blessings of the Lord and I do hope that you would just consider the things I have said. I do not argue just for the sake of arguing. If anything at all, just give brother Worley the benefit of the doubt, and search the word of God and see for yourself, if the things I’m saying are true or not. If the things I’m saying are true, you’ll find them there in scripture. The Lord bless you. Pease pray for Pastor Worley.

    • You must be in a lot of agony because you use a lot of words… get over yourself, Gerie.

      You are supporting a man who called for genocide and have turned yourself into a pretzel trying to excuse his words and behavior. Shame on you.

      You are a pawn of the devil, whether you see it in your self-righteous self or not.

      Elaine is making the point that there are “pet” sins in the church (gluttony), and offensive sins (homosexuality). If you think one is more of a sin than the other, you are sorely mistaken.

    • Nick Peluso said

      I’m not taking the blame or supporting the conduct for Pastor Worley or his congregation or anyone else that supports their way of thinking and then when it’s all said and done, they want to hide behind the Gospel and claim that it’s Biblical and God’s will. I will take responsibility for my own actions and suffer the repercussions of what I do and say, and if it may be the wrong thing I will not expect others to back me and sweep it under the rug attempting to hide it behind the Gospel of Tough love, Gospel of Nice …… heck let me come up with one …. Gospel of ridiculous.

      Folks need to keep watching clip 1, especially the Pastor and congregation …….. the more you see it and the more you analyze what is said there the more one can conclude that the words were very heart felt / very malicious / and very wrong. Clip 2 can be the start of the healing process but no one can justify clip 1.

      And while we keep going back to this issue ….. if there was a child ….. that sang such a song with the wording of “Ain’t No Homo gonna make it to Heaven” and it came from the same congregation …… who is responsible? You bet Satan is having a great time and you bet we all better pray for this misguided congregation to include it’s so called unblemished Leader. If the song is all SINNERS ain’t gonna make it to heaven without JESUS …… my response is God Bless You and carry on.

      In my Young Law Enforcement career ….. I was back slidden …… I became bitter towards crime and criminals in general and my attitude towards the normal thought process that Police Officers should have of being accountable to the public and walking the ” white Line “. I was walking in my will, with my thoughts, fulfilling my agenda and yet I was still putting people in jail without a second thought of their condition or what I was doing …… was I breaking any laws, no ….. but the day finally came that while I was on vacation, I found myself in the most bizarre set of circumstances where I was in public grossly intoxicated and wound up being placed under arrest. While in the jail I learned that I acted like an animal, which was totally out of character for me and at some point threw food at one of the detention officers …… I lost a 25 year career for a half hour of stupidity and bizarre behavior. I may have opened the door to a seducing spirit while I was in that drunken state ….. not sure …… but I can tell you that at the time if you had asked my brother and sister officers I was a very respected Officer and destined to climb the ladder because I performed my duties in a flawless and very accountable manner. I very rarely drank alcohol or partied as the saying goes ….. but this one occasion I let my guard down, tied one on and went to jail.

      When that embarrassing day was over and while my trial date was pending, I was deep in thought as to what direction my life would eventually take. I got on my face before the Lord and acknowledged that I was wrong and living in sin and would take steps to fix what I had done. I also prayed that somehow I might be given the chance to continue in my career and would perform my duties with a new added component compassion for my fellow man whether they be a victim or a criminal. I would stop living my off time in a reckless fashion. I put the whole situation in God’s hands and said ” Your will be done “.

      I appeared before the Judge ….. admitted my guilt …… let him know that I was an embarrassment to society and the Law Enforcement community. Let him know of my shame and how stupid I had been because I did not live up to who I was supposed to be, what I was supposed to represent, and how I was supposed to carry myself especially when in view of the public.

      My jaw dropped to the ground when I heard what came out of the Judge’s mouth ….. ” you’re being too hard on yourself son ….. you made a mistake. You’re not the first Police Officer to come into my court that has broken the law. What you did is trivial compared to what some of the others did. I’m going to cut you a break provided the arresting Officer has no objections.

      I was shocked, I was shown compassion and mercy ….. I was given a second chance.

      The repercussion of my actions did not end there though ….. I had to begin a new career with another agency at alot less money. Within 90 days my financial situation became really bad, my wife took up with a wild partying crowd and left me, taking my first born two year old son with her. That really hurt …. I came from a broken family and I had previously swore that when I had children, my children would not go through what I went through and would have a mother and father that stayed together and were a family.

      In three months time, I lost my job, my family, and my financial stability for a stupid drunken half hour escapade.

      I made corrections in my life. I continued to drive on and try to be the best Officer and Person that I was capable of being. I had a new perspective on things because I had knowledge that most Police Officers do not have, I knew what it was like to have the Iron door shut behind me and to be captive within a 9 by 12 cell …… very sobering experience.

      Through out the whole process my heart told me that I had for a very extended period of time drifted away from God’s plan for my life and that I had been under chastisement. I saw my wrong …..took responsibility for my wrong …… cried out to God to deliver me from the bondage I had created for myself. Over the next ten years God delivered me, blessed me, and returned to me twice what I had before including a new life with a new wife and two new children. I took responsibility for my actions, I repented of my sin, I was restored by my Loving and All Powerful God that extends Grace and Mercy and sometimes Chastisement. The Lord used the righteous men that I had originally wronged to start my healing process ….. the first persons that extended me mercy and compassion were the Judge and the Arresting Officer … something that is usually not done in my part of the country. We aren’t protected by unions or union reps or attorneys as some of the Northern States are.

      I suppose I could have blamed the Officer for going to jail, but I didn’t. I said then and say now, what happened to me was a direct result of my actions and no one else’s. If I could go back and do it again, I wouldn’t change a thing. I became a better Police Officer. I became a better person. I became a better Christian.

      I say all this to say, I am not blameless. I do however recognize that sometimes persons who make poor decisions have to be accountable for their actions without that person or others trying to put the blame on someone else. In my condition I could not go back and undo what had happened ….. the damage was done. It took me ten years to recover what I threw away. The only issue that could not be repaired was my first son was the victim of having to live in a broken home because of me.

      I have been in uniform and public service in some fashion since I was 15 years old. I am 47 now. I have been a Firefighter, junior Firefighter, Paratrooper in the US Army, and for the last 23 years a Police Officer. I was not immune from suffering repercussions based on my previous years of service.

      This Pastor and congregation in NC need to renew their Spirit, Cry Out to the Lord for direction and deliverance from their condition, and drive on in their ministry with a new set of eyes and direction. They may suffer trials and tribulations but to what extent is totally up to them. They do need prayer and compassion, but they also need to see the wrong in this situation and adjust accordingly.

    • Nick Peluso said

      “All the love and good will in the world won’t get that deadly sin out of them. You can do good deeds towards them for the rest of their lives and those good deeds will NEVER touch their sin. But the preaching of Gods word will! It will give them knowledge that will make them understand whats actually going on inside of them. The evil thats destroying them from the inside out, but remains hidden from their view.” (GERIE)

      Who ever said that extending love and compassion was to be done without preaching the Word of God ? Everything I have said is to extend to them compassion and love while preaching to them the Word of God ….. the spirit of what is being preached and how it is delivered are half the battle …… the Word of God does not need your help to get the point across, therefore it is to be done from our perspective in a compassionate loving way. If you do it in a manner laced with judgement, all you do is turn people’s ears off. If the situation arises where someone’s heart is so hardened that they will not accept what you have to say or how you say it after you have tried in the correct loving and compassionate spirit, then I have faith that God will bring someone into that person’s life that will be the only person that the lost individual would be willing to listen to with the same message,

      We cannot minister to the lost with the wrong spirit …. we risk being the cause of them to close their mind and their ears.

    • Elaine said

      I am SOOOOOO glad that you are a policeman!

    • gerie said

      Rose, Believe me, I got over myself over thirty years ago and good riddance to her. Most importantly, is that when she died all shame went with her. So since the Lord freed me from all that, I would never willingly accept any shame from you. Especially being unwarranted. That’s a pretty serious charge,”a pawn of the devil.” It almost feels like hate speech, something I know you don’t approve of. I don’t know if you meant it that way, but I’ll choose to love you in the Lord, and give you the benefit of the doubt since you are my sister in Christ and we’re part of the same body. I will continue to support Pastor Worley and pray for him, because he is also my true brother in Christ and a good man who loves the Lord with all of his heart. By the way, has anyone else ever wondered what happened to the rest of the video? It really does matter what was said before and after that two minute clip. For sure we know that things said, before and after can make all the difference in the world. I’ve listened to other things by him and he really is a powerful preacher who loves people, as many in his church have testified. It seems to be his custom to give an alter call at the end of his services, inviting them to come and have their sins washed away by the blood of Jesus, according to the Gospel of Christ. Who do you think might be responsible for cutting everything else out of the video, leaving only the most incriminating part? Was it posted to destroy the man’s ministry? Who would do something like that? Satan no doubt, trying to take down a powerful preacher. Be careful, the same thing could happen to any one of us.

      Dear Rose, I’m afraid that you are the one who is mistaken, if you believe that you can lump all sin together like that. It is you who are in error, and the mistake you are making is huge. By this, I can now see why you don’t seem to have a major problem with homosexuality if you think that it is only equal to the sin of overeating. As for me, I would rather stand before the Lord explaining why I over ate, rather then trying to explain why I thought it was OK to live my life practicing the sin of homosexuality, which God Himself has classified, as an abomination. They are not even on the same page. I’m surprised by what you said, but it does shed some light for me, on where you are coming from, and your understanding of the scriptures.

      When I talked earlier about hanging out with drug addicts or gays and the negative effects this might have on our children, I was reminded of Jay Bakker, son of Jim and Tammy. When they lost their ministry and her husband went to prison, Tammy found comfort in the gay community. She hung around with gays for years. The effects this had on her children were very real and far reaching. Now her son is a “gay affirming pastor” a preacher of “grace” who preaches that being gay is not a sin. He is one of the most vocal advocates for gay marriage and one of the first things he did as an ordained Pastor was to perform a gay marriage ceremony for two lesbians, just as soon as it became legal. Now he finally”feels free” preaching his own personal views of the Bible, to both gays and lesbians. Not surprisingly his focus in the Bible, centers exclusively on Grace and tolerance. The consequences of the decision Tammy Faye made to hang out with gays, are responsible for leading many many people astray today and may very well doom her own son to Hell. This one liberal Pastor’s influence is far reaching and devastating to those who come to him, really seeking for the truth. However, they will never receive the knowledge of the truth while attending this man’s church. Moral of the story is, that it really does matter who we hang around with, and the consequences of our decisions, will last forever. And also we can see, that when things become unbalanced with too much grace and tolerance its effects can cause us to abandon the true Gospel. And we can lose the Salvation that Jesus died for.

      I have heard there is a video circulating around, of a child singing “ain’t no homo’s in Heaven” supposedly from Pastor Worley’s church. I don’t know if that’s true or not, but if it is, are the words the children are actually singing, the truth or a lie? Will there be any homosexuals in Heaven? I believe they have been taught the truth in easy to remember, song form, so that they would remember the lesson all of their lives, and so that they’d be sure to stay away from that deadly sin. That very deadly sin, that causes young men to commit suicide and many to die prematurely, from aides. They are right. There will be absolutely no homosexuals in Heaven. So they have been taught correctly. Now contrast that with something that children might be taught in Jay Bakkers liberal church. It might go something like this:”all homos will go to Heaven, cause Pastor Jay says so.”

      This will be my last comment here, because when the conversation starts to disintegrate to name calling, and begins to become mean spirited there is nothing left to be learned and I don’t want to be a part of something for which there is no purpose. I have learned a lot with you all and have been blessed with the sharing of thoughts, especially with you Nick, thanks. I feel that I brought a different side to the conversation, and at least may have given you all something to think about.
      God bless you Rose, and all.
      Your Sister in Christ,
      Gerie

    • gerie said

      One last thing. About that little song the children learned to sing, “aint no homo’s in Heaven”. What a great idea! When children go to school and their teachers and their textbooks begin the brain washing process and they begin to teach them that its OK and normal to be gay, the Holy Spirit can just remind them of that little song they learned in Sunday school, “there aint no homo’s in Heaven, there ain’t no homo’s in Heaven” and even in that envoirment they will be fortified with the truth. I think that Pastor Worley is on to something!

      (Proverbs 22:6) Train up a child in the way he should go: and when he is old, he will not depart from it.

      God Bless All

    • Nick Peluso said

      “I won’t have to suggest anyone be fenced in since they will already be in the Golden Corral!” (Elaine)

      Now that’s funny !!!

    • Nick Peluso said

      Gerie,

      I wish All of God’s Direction, Wisdom, and Blessings for your life and endeavors.

      Remember, not all Christians agree on everything …… Acts 15:39

    • Gerie,

      Jesus used scathing sarcasm toward the Pharisees and deeply insulted them. My words were mild in comparison; you got off easy.

    • Nick Peluso said

      I watched clip 2 ….. hard to find.

      I’m not impressed …… clip 2 occurs a week after the first clip ….. As a Police Officer I have seen the look on this man’s face a thousand times when they are searching for the right words to say ….. he initially looks like a deer caught in the headlights of an oncoming car ….. and I’m not trying to be funny. It is obvious that there was some outcry that was brought to his attention from the first sermon and he is trying to soften it up. It is also obvious that he is in strange waters here because he has never had to be politically correct before regarding this subject and it appears that there may be some of the gay community in the audience or maybe some gay activists. He struggles at first and can’t even come up with the words homosexual or gay….. he uses the word queer a couple of times but tries to find another word because obviously someone during the week told him that queer was a negative term regarding homosexuality and he says he’s trying to find another word ….. he also uses the word sodomite. Once he goes into the sin pitch he is fine ….. he is strong …. and is able to get the point across boldly and passionately that they are loved by God and God wants to save them. He says I love you but I hate your sin. He goes on to say they are all welcome in the church and that he wants them there so that he can preach to them and get them saved.

      I go back to my first statement ….. if only he had left his personal spin off of it …… addressed the issue as he would any other sin ….. started out and finished as he does towards the middle to end of the second clip ….. there would be no issue.

      Unfortunately he has been comfortable for a long time in putting his own personal spin on this particular sin condition that came out in all of it’s contempt filled rhetoric we see in clip 1.

      How tragic, and furthermore how difficult is it going to be now for all of us to witness to others whether they be homosexual or not regarding this sin condition ?

    • Nick,

      I’m going to chime in with Elaine and say that I’m glad you’re here and that I’m very happy you’re a police officer.

      I appreciate your attention to detail, your analytical mind, and your unruffled feathers – all skills refined by years of dealing with all kinds of people and managing yourself in the process.

      I hope you stick around.

  35. Dawn said

    Wow! This subject really does ruffle our feathers, and understandably so!!! LA, I love this blog! Thank you for posting it! I loved it so much that I reposted it on my FB page (gave you credit) and was immediately attacked by a non-homosexual Christian friend who’s best friend is a lesbian AND the lesbian best friend and her wife!!! The lesbian women believe that they were born that way, even going so far as to post the “Born This Way” video by Lady Gaga on my page!! The “wife” attacked me for posting it, LA for writing it, and the pastor for preaching his sermon. She said that I hurt her and her partner very deeply and they DO NOT want any prayers, thank you very much!!

    I was shocked by the attack b/c I had no idea it would be taken the way it was. I also didn’t know that my lesbian FB friend was even reading my status updates! I chose to delete the whole thing b/c it made me and my FB page feel dirty. After much prayer and contemplation, I sent a private message to my heterosexual friend who was also upset and explained the reason I posted it was for good. She replied that she understands what the Bible says about homosexuality, but what about her friend and others who have felt “different” since early childhood? What are they supposed to do with their feelings? I don’t have an answer for that. Does anyone here know how I can answer that question? She also said that she doesn’t believe that God makes mistakes. I agree with her on that point. So, what am I supposed to tell this woman? Help!

    • Well, to follow Jesus we have to be willing to give up everything and take up our cross. This includes our perceived sexuality. I say perceived, because I am convinced that when we give our life to the Lord and follow the Holy Spirit, our internal desires will be made righteous. These innate desires, even at a young age, is our sinful nature manifesting in our lives. It has nothing to do with being born that way, like having blue eyes or black hair.

      I am in an accountability group and many of the men, including myself have and do wrestle with pornography. One of the men was upset because he had learned to control his actions but he wanted God to take away the desire to view pornography. Overwelmingly, many of the men just thought that it was in men’s nature to be visual creatures and that such a desire would never subside. Well after some months of praying and struggling, he came in overjoyed. He said that God had taken away the desire outright!

      God can set us right if we have the faith and give it to Him. Gay people don’t want to hear this because they don’t want to feel shame about their desires.

    • Phoebe Wagner-Wootten said

      Dawn,

      I understand where you are coming from! Where this subject is concerned, it doesn’t seem to matter how nicely you state your opinion, that as a Christian, you feel homosexuality is not condoned by the Bible. Anyone who says they do not agree with this “lifestyle” is verbally attacked by being called a bigot and a hater and much worse sometimes. I’ve seen it countless times on Facebook. Then after attacking the individual who happens to say they do not agree with homosexuality, they then start attacking Christians in general, saying things such as “there is no God” or “I don’t want anything to do with a God that discriminates against people” and “Christians are delusional and believe in a book of Fairy Tales (Bible)”. It’s very depressing and unless you want to come under attack, it makes you want to not say anything at all!

      I now understand how Noah must have felt when God commanded him to preach to people to repent because he was going to send a flood to cleanse the Earth and everyone laughed at him (or worse)!

    • Phoebe Wagner-Wootten said

      I just wanted to add…I’m not sure how to answer your questions myself, but it’s true, God does NOT make mistakes. But it is the Devil that has given people unnatural desires…not God!

    • gerie said

      Dawn, In the first place a true christian doesn’t say things such as, “I know what the Bible say, BUT…” so you might actually have to think of her differently then what you’re used to,in light of the way shes acting towards you and also towards God and His word .True christians don’t have a problem with God’s word. We just obey it, already knowing that this is the Father’s will and that there is no other way.First, you yourself have to know what you believe and be fully committed to stand there. There is no middle ground for truth. No comfortable place you can rest. It will be a battle for all who are sold out to Jesus, until the day we die. Truth is absolute, there is no other way. Either we side with God or we side with the world and their excuses. Nothing they can say will help them on judgement day. Try standing there and looking God straight in the eye and accuse Him of making you this way and that He is somehow responsible for your behavior. Dawn, what would you tell your married girlfriend if she was lusting after another man, and struggling with powerful feelings? What about a school teacher who is struggling with powerful lustful feeling towards a student? What about an unmarried young virgin?What should she do with her feelings? The answer is right there. Its easy to understand. However, it’s as simple and as complex as you’re willing to make it.

      Jesus never made answers complex, but for sure His remedy is never easy. Thats why its called the narrow road, because its hard to go to Heaven. Not everybody that says to Him, Lord Lord will be saved, but only those who actually do the will of the Father. Giving yourself over to homosexual feelings and acting them out is not the Fathers will.So what did Jesus say? If your hand causes you to sin, then cut it off, its better to lose only your hand (or suffer through life with unacted upon feelings) rather than to burn in Hell forever. If we act on our feelings then we are sinning. If we’re saved, we are in serious trouble unless we quickly repent and change our mind and side with the truth against ourselves and our feelings. If we are not saved we need the blood of Jesus to wash away our sins and our evil conscience and weaknesses. There were many things I did before I was saved that went away after being washed by His blood.I lost all desires for those things at my conversion or soon after as the Holy Spirit showed them to me.Your friend is doing her gay friend no favors by sheltering her from the truth.

      I have been writing a blogpost about this subject that I’ll be posting later today. It might help you and give you some answers. If you trully care about your homosexual friends, you will have to take a strong stand and be willing to suffer the persecution that taking such a stand will cost you. I had already started a blogpost about this subject, earlier this week, which was the main reason I commented so much here, as it was clearly on my mind. My blog is http://exposingthedarknessandtellingthetruth

      God Bless You, Dawn.

  36. Nick Peluso said

    L.A. ….. my first comment numbered 33 did not come through, only the second part did …. I can see that it is still on my screen, but it says it is awaiting moderation. I may have messed something up when I added a reply to my own comment before it was approved …… sorry.

  37. Phoebe Wagner-Wootten said

    I just found this web-site which is very disturbing! Christians are definitely becoming the minority in society and are being told to adapt to the “new age” way of thinking, even if it disagrees with their Bible principles, or stay silent. If they do not agree to these terms, they are denied university funding set aside for registered university sanctioned clubs and organizations. They truly do want to stamp Christianity out! http://thecollegeconservative.com/2012/03/23/christian-groups-under-assault-on-american-campuses/

  38. Elaine said

    taking a break here to study and reflect on 1 Corinthians 13
    Have a blessed day kiddos!

  39. Nick Peluso said

    This was my very first post on this discussion that for some reason did not come through ….. the second post starts with ” Forgot to add ….”

    Let’s think about the words contained in the sermon given by the Pastor ……. What would be the Pastor’s argument ? That he was lead by the Holy Spirit to make such statements towards a sect of sinner’s that commit an abomination to the Lord with their type of lifestyle. After all, is that not how all Pastors are supposed to be led in determining what they preach and how they are to preach it?

    Here are my thoughts on the walled compound originally designed for the homosexual population:

    Why stop with just those individuals ?

    Lets include:

    Murderers, Rapists, Robbers, Burglars, Drug dealers …… We already have prisons for those persons you say …. ok

    Gang members, Alcoholics, Defense Attorney’s, Juvenile Delinquents, Persons with Physical Handicaps ….. a little harsh you say…..ok

    Anyone who commits a sin, to include
    anyone who has had a bad thought towards another
    anyone who defiles his body with tobacco or alcohol
    anyone who covets someone else’s wife or property
    anyone who looks at pornography
    anyone who listens to secular music or watches secular movies
    anyone who gossips or talks bad about someone else behind their back
    anyone who has money but refuses to help out those in need when the opportunity arises to do so
    anyone who has sex before they are married
    anyone who gets involved in eating or drinking contests while over half the world goes to bed hungry daily
    anyone who accepts political influence or bribes to fulfill their own agenda
    anyone who disobeys the Spirit when God has determined a task, set path, or direction for your life
    anyone who withholds telling others about Jesus when the opportunity arises

    etc ……..

    When it’s all said and done ……. EVERYONE …… should be held within those walls to include the Pastor who has already presupposed that the Homosexual crowd is beyond God’s reach through the unblemished Blood of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ and their only hope is to be walled up until they die off one by one.

    It is very dangerous to put sin in some type of rank structure based on the thoughts of men.

    God is Holy and ALL sin, whether it be a thought, homosexual act, or murder is worthy of one thing and one thing only …… Hell Fire. Thanks be to God All Mighty that He loved us enough to leave eternity to be manifested in the flesh for the sole purpose of dying for the World so that the world may spend eternity future with Him in Heaven.

    What the pastor should have said is ” If you are part of the homosexual community, We as a Church love you and want you here in our church and our congregation because here is where you will meet Jesus and Jesus wants to be your Lord and Savior. ”

    It is the believer’s job to get people to Jesus ….. it is the relationship with Jesus that brings conviction of wrong doing through the Holy Spirit. That is God’s job to correct and chastize, not the believer’s.

    May God Bless all of you through Jesus Christ Our Savior.

    Nick Peluso

    P.S.

    Love what you do L.A. and the way you do it.

  40. Elaine said

    I am a mom and grandma and this blog topic has me thinking about making good stew…..put all the ingredients in the pot and simmer and simmer and simmer, adding a bit of this and a bit of that but sometimes having to catch a piece of gristly meat back out and throw it away no matter how stubbornly we wish it was good meat….yes it came from the same cow but it would be a part better left out of this dish….then simmer and simmer and simmer……because if ya keep it at a rolling boil your veggies get all mushy and the meat can sink and taste scorched by the fire that burned so hot.

  41. John T. said

    Wow. I’ve been following this topic through media sources and was very dismayed at all the negative comments against religion in general and Christians in particular. So I came here, to a Christian site, where I expected to find at least some form of solidarity of opinion or united front. What I’m reading through the comments instead, are people resorting to sarcastic remarks and criticism of other Christians’ comments. I expect this from those who are “anti-religion”, but I did not expect to see it from a group of Christians toward one another. I see comments condemning others for not having a “loving” enough attitude, and in the next sentence basically, using sarcasm to disagree with what another person has said. Where’s the “love” and “patience” in that kind of attitude? If Christians are not able to extend the same kind of love and consideration to other Christians that they are preaching must be shown to others, what kind of example is that setting? While I simply find this sad and disheartening, you can bet those who are anti-Christian/religion are quite proud of themselves for causing this kind of rift among the Christian community. To them, this is a victory! Every day, these anti-religious groups are chipping away at Christians’ faith and, before long, Christianity will be shattered like the shards of a broken vase!

    • Nick Peluso said

      Hi John ….. You are correct it is disheartening ….. what is the alternative ? Souls are at stake here. The lost need Jesus, it is the responsibility of the Church to minister to the lost. There are two methods it seems to minister to the lost, I’ll use the terms created or used by another Christian ….. Gospel of Tough Love and Gospel of Nice. Now the dissention here is between us Christians ….. it is our duty to hash these issues out just as any business, family, or public service does. God doesn’t have to worry about those under Grace in terms of where they will spend eternity, He worries about those that are not under Grace and it is our mission to go out and minister to these lost individuals.

      Having said that, there are guidlines or rules that need to be followed as to how the ministry should go after the lost. Should the lost be sought with judgement and contempt or should they be sought with genuine heartfelt concern ?

      Let me give you a scenario so to speak.

      If a person was getting ready to jump off a building to kill themselves because they felt worthless with no hope to overcome their circumstances and the person getting ready to jump did not realize that they in actuality were getting ready to jump into the pit of hell for all eternity ….. You’d feel concern for that person wouldn’t you ?

      Let’s add to the scenario and say you are that person’s only hope to talk them out of what they are getting ready to do. Would your approach be ….. yeah I agree your worthless and have no hope, but I don’t want you to jump because I’ll feel guilty and besides people love you.

      Or would your approach be ….. don’t jump ….. people love you, I love you, your life does have meaning and is worth something. Your not being here will create voids in person’s lives that they may not be able to overcome. There is no isssue too great that we cannot overcome the issue. There is hope.

      Now that scenario represents:

      The person on the building are the lost or sinners that are not under Grace. The sinner does not understand that their death will not be the end of their circumstance, but will actually be the beginning of a worse condition that will last forever.

      You represent the Church, and unfortunately there are two approaches to the problem, one without compassion, and one with compassion.

      Which approach do you think God would want you to take ? Remember you may only get one chance to make a difference.

      The issue between us Christians is all about the approach ….. the sinner does not have a dog in this fight as their eyes are closed and they don’t have a clue yet as to who Jesus is or that beyond this world lies an eternity in hell fire or an eternity with Jesus in Heaven.

      Can I as a christian stand by and watch another christian cause someone to jump off that building into an eternity of hell fire because their approach was in the wrong spirit ?

      I can’t and I won’t. God will surely hold me accountable at the end of time. Furthermore, how can I possibly sleep at night knowing that, not only was I not a solution to the problem, but I was an active part of the problem and caused someone to spend forever in hell fire because I failed to intervene.

      That is what the debate is about ….. these tough lover’s want to extend tough love to those they are responsible for, but don’t want the same tough love extended to them.

      I’d rather be sarcastic to make a point, then be held accountable for shutting up.

    • Nick Peluso said

      I did not realize that L.A. wanted to drop the dicussion. Sorry L.A.

      My last post ….. May God Bless All of You through Jesus Christ Our Lord and Savior.

      Nick Peluso

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